New datasheet style

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Does anyone else prefer the old datasheets to the new "blue" ones? In particular I found the tables much easier to read in the old ones.

Apologies if this is the wrong forum, none of them seemed particularly well suited.

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My personal impression is that the "new" ones have been written by guys that were never given some hardware to play with, but just created those documents from some design spec sheets. The previous ones were much more detailed and precise, but again, this is just my own impression.

Einstein was right: "Two things are unlimited: the universe and the human stupidity. But i'm not quite sure about the former..."

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Have they gone from technical references to marketing literature?

The largest known prime number: 282589933-1

It's easy to stop breaking the 10th commandment! Break the 8th instead. 

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Torby wrote:
Have they gone from technical references to marketing literature?

No, no. They still talk about interrupts, timers and PWM modes. But in a way they seem to use a different style of explaining how the chip really works, which does neglect some details necessary to fully understand the hardware. But then, a modern Xmega IS more complex than the average Mega32... Maybe i'm just mislead by my different levels of expertise regarding those two architectures...

Einstein was right: "Two things are unlimited: the universe and the human stupidity. But i'm not quite sure about the former..."

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What AVR's use the new format? I have not seen one.

I would rather attempt something great and fail, than attempt nothing and succeed - Fortune Cookie

 

"The critical shortage here is not stuff, but time." - Johan Ekdahl

 

"Step N is required before you can do step N+1!" - ka7ehk

 

"If you want a career with a known path - become an undertaker. Dead people don't sue!" - Kartman

"Why is there a "Highway to Hell" and only a "Stairway to Heaven"? A prediction of the expected traffic load?"  - Lee "theusch"

 

Speak sweetly. It makes your words easier to digest when at a later date you have to eat them ;-)  - Source Unknown

Please Read: Code-of-Conduct

Atmel Studio6.2/AS7, DipTrace, Quartus, MPLAB, RSLogix user

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Neither have I. The hint from DO1THL is Xmega?

You can put lipstick on a pig, but it is still a pig.

I've never met a pig I didn't like, as long as you have some salt and pepper.

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Me 2

I'd like to see one of these new "blue" data sheets too!
Which specific AtxMega part are you referring to, mojo-chan?

I went to the Atmel website and searched on "atxmega64 datasheet" and "atxmega64 data sheet" and got a "No Hits" response. Isn't that Damn Pathetic for such a monster global company like Atmel!? I tried several of the manual click-routes on their website and still couldn't get to an AtXMega data sheet - too much marketing crap & hoopla and not enough good, solid information.

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www.atmel.com
Products, Atmel AVR 8- and 32-bit
(Scroll a wee bit down)8/16-bit AVR XMEGA
(Scroll down to the device in question, e.g.) ATxmega64A1U
Select the Documents tab

(You should end up here: http://www.atmel.com/devices/ATX... )

This is the only reasonable way to get to info for a specific device. If you do not use this to get to data sheets, then HOW are you doing it? :shock:

(wow! I didn't get captcha'd! First time since Mollom was integrated into the site, and me posting something with an URL.)

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No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

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hey mojo-chan!

Are you aware that for e.g. ATxmega64A1U there are two documents that applies.

One data sheet specific for the ATxmega64A1U, quite terse and only 154 pages.

One data sheet for the AU series of XMEGAs, with information looking more like a Tiny/Mega sheet and being 497 pages.

From the short, specific, data sheet:

Quote:
This device data sheet only contains part specific information with a short description of each peripheral and module. The XMEGA AU manual describes the modules and peripherals indepth. The XMEGA application notes contain example code and show applied use of the modules and peripherals

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

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The latest XMEGA revisions use it, i.e. the non A and D suffix (note that AU is different to A and has the newer style).

The new datasheets contain the same content as the old, but have a new brand styling (color!).

- Dean :twisted:

Make Atmel Studio better with my free extensions. Open source and feedback welcome!

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Johan,

FYI - I go to www.atmel.com. In the left hand "FIND IT" block I click on "By Device", then on "Microcontrollers(441)" and I just get a slide show heralding the bliss of Atmel Studio 6 and something about going "Beyond the Edge". Yet, when I follow your specific click path, I do get to the data sheet. Where did you order your Secret Decoder Ring? I'd like to get one too.

Anyway, I did download a copy of the new blue "XMEGA AU MANUAL" - aptly named "doc8331" & here are my immediate comments.

1. Looks like a real printer ink/toner waster with all those dark blue bands and heavy chart outlines. ( I like to print out applicable sections of the manual and data sheets and bind them into my project notebook for each project. That way I can red-line or yellow highlight key parameters, settings, etc for that specific project. Which I find very helpful when I come back to the project at a later time when I've forgotten most of the details of its implementation.)

2. In case the lesser internet savy big wigs at Atmel Corporate didn't notice, we no longer live in a 3:4 Portrait Mode World, we now live in 16:9 Landscapestan. I don't get why we are still endlessly scrolling to the bottom of portrait mode pages when my primary viewing device (laptop) has a 16:9 landscape viewing window.

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Quote:

In the left hand "FIND IT" block

Oh, that... I found it unusable, and assume it's only real purpose was to make some over-ambitious web kiddie happy since (s)he was allowed(?) to create something very complicated.

I am all for using modern web-techniques when it makes sense, but one of the really beautiful things with the web is it's simplicity. One can use e.g. a content manager to generate plain old web pages just as well as letting it feed some complex scripted thing, and the former actually becomes more usable. All IMO.

My standard rant is about application notes. We once had a list of all app notes for AVRs. Now, the only thing I can manage to get is a list of ALL app notes for ALL microcontrollers. And in that list Atmel has decided not to include the app note number. Sick irony that this USABLE number lacks in the list, but that all downloaded documents come names with only Atmels internal document number. Talk about not designing for the end user...

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

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I'll take the portrait mode of life myself when it comes to datasheets. They print the way you see them on the screen.(That's old fart thinking though)

This "Blue-Sheet" is annoying. Especially when my black and white laser printer tries to grayscale the blue. :(

Maybe Atmel is in bed with Toner/Ink suppliers? We have to buy new printers or more toner./ink in order to print their data sheets to be readable, and Atmel gets a kickback :lol:

I would rather attempt something great and fail, than attempt nothing and succeed - Fortune Cookie

 

"The critical shortage here is not stuff, but time." - Johan Ekdahl

 

"Step N is required before you can do step N+1!" - ka7ehk

 

"If you want a career with a known path - become an undertaker. Dead people don't sue!" - Kartman

"Why is there a "Highway to Hell" and only a "Stairway to Heaven"? A prediction of the expected traffic load?"  - Lee "theusch"

 

Speak sweetly. It makes your words easier to digest when at a later date you have to eat them ;-)  - Source Unknown

Please Read: Code-of-Conduct

Atmel Studio6.2/AS7, DipTrace, Quartus, MPLAB, RSLogix user

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I get the idea that the AVR32 is in the same bucket as the AVR8, but shouldn't we be able to pick one or the other when searching?

Imagecraft compiler user

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I don't think the new layout is that bad. Not worth to complain about really. There are worse things in life.

And who prints datasheets anyway?

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Looks pretty nice to me, though I haven't dug through looking for details yet.

The largest known prime number: 282589933-1

It's easy to stop breaking the 10th commandment! Break the 8th instead. 

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jgmdesign,

I once did a cost comparison study between the cost/ounce of the actual quantity of ink inside a typical ink jet cartridge and a 1/4 ounce bottle of top-of-the-line French Perfume. The French Perfume is cheaper, though I never let my wife see the cost study for obvious reasons to all of us married Freaks.

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Quote:
The French Perfume is cheaper, though I never let my wife see the cost study for obvious reasons

Nope, you wouldn't want to have your wife smear herself up with ink. (Or would you? :wink:)

And printing AVR data sheets with Chanel no 5 would seriously hamper readability.. :D

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

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jayjay1974 wrote:
I don't think the new layout is that bad. Not worth to complain about really. There are worse things in life.

And who prints datasheets anyway?

I print them all the time, at work, using their paper and toner. :D

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bobgardner wrote:
I get the idea that the AVR32 is in the same bucket as the AVR8, but shouldn't we be able to pick one or the other when searching?
Click the little orange arrow to the right of "Atmel AVR 8- and 32-bit Microcontrollers" and you can filter by sub-family.

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It's a heavy download (6.6GB), but you may want to download the latest TechLib DVD instead:

http://www.atmel.no/techlib/

It contains everything (datasheets, appnotes, etc) which you can search locally. At work we use the "FAE CD" which is a slightly more complete version of the Techlib (contains additional confidential information) and it's much easier/faster than working with the site if you have the bandwidth to spare, use a lot of datasheets and want them locally.

- Dean :twisted:

Make Atmel Studio better with my free extensions. Open source and feedback welcome!

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Quote:

you may want to download the latest TechLib DVD instead

+1

I have done this several times though it was a while (a year?) since the last time.

(Just started a d/l over a 3G connection. "10 hours remaining" (i get about 175 KB/s). It'll have to work while I have my beauty sleep - 10 hours will not do much there... :wink:)

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

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jayjay1974 wrote:

And who prints datasheets anyway?

I do - though usually in short extracts, not five hundred pages! Very handy to be able to scribble on the thing.

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Hey Dean!

You might inform the makers of the TechLib that some stuff in there needs an update. Example: The "Datasheets graphical view" (8-bit AVR Microcontrollers, Datasheets, Graphical view). Those tabular layouts are really usable as an overview of the different models and "families", but e.g. the really tiny Tiny's and several USB Mega's are missing.

Also, the latest Studio mentioned under Software is AS5.

Let me know if such proof-reading is actually of value for Atmel and I will continue reporting.

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

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Myself, I have a concern on how a document prints.
I don't like having to print large areas of color or grey scale on my Laser-jet B&W printer.
It would be nice if Atmel would give some attention to this.

Maybe in the future I will be able to afford a color Tablet that can handle PDF's.

Oh well, my two cents added.....

I'll believe corporations
are people when Texas executes one.

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Atmel AVR Datasheets seem to have reverted to the old style for updates posted in September/October.
The new style datasheets seem to have been a mid-July through August phenomena.

Perhaps this comment received attention:

Chuck-Rowst wrote:
1. Looks like a real printer ink/toner waster with all those dark blue bands and heavy chart outlines.

I could be wrong, again...

Stan

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Quote:
I could be wrong, again...

Yup, ATtiny20 data sheet (rev D) just posted has the blue strip at the top each page.

Stan