Mini Vs Micro USB Type B Connectors

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Howard_Smith
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Posted by Howard_Smith: Wed. Feb 22, 2017 - 12:28 PM
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Are there any guidelines when deciding between using mini and micro USB type B connectors when designing electronic equipment/ hardware, or is it just personal preference? I've tried searching for the answers to this myself, but everything I've found has simply tried to explain the physical differences between the two, I want to know when to use mini and when to use micro.

 

Also it may or may not be on interest, but I'm planning on the USB connection primarily for charging, and for occasionally connecting to a PC to deliver firmware updates...

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Kartman
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Posted by Kartman: Wed. Feb 22, 2017 - 12:32 PM
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Full size type B are virtually impossible to pull off a pcb whereas the mini and micro tend to be rather easy. As for choosing, that's up to you. Electrically they're the same.

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Bronze Markawneil
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Posted by awneil: Wed. Feb 22, 2017 - 12:33 PM
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I think you'll find that micro has superseded mini for pretty much all new equipment; so micro would be the one to go for - otherwise your users will effectively have to find a "special" cable for your gizmo.

 

 

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Howard_Smith
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Posted by Howard_Smith: Wed. Feb 22, 2017 - 12:45 PM
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Kartman wrote:
Full size type B are virtually impossible to pull off a pcb whereas the mini and micro tend to be rather easy...
 

Indeed *cough cough* ATMEL-ICE ;)

 

awneil wrote:

I think you'll find that micro has superseded mini for pretty much all new equipment; so micro would be the one to go for - otherwise your users will effectively have to find a "special" cable for your gizmo.

 

Good point - micro it is then.

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Gold Markclawson
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Posted by clawson: Wed. Feb 22, 2017 - 01:15 PM
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Just look at every phone, tablet and camera in your house and see what they are all using. End users like it when all the devices in the house use the same USB charging jack so they can mix and match chargers! (well I do anyway)

 

EDIT: forgot to say "with the notable exception of Apple who just want to irritate users" (something they seem particularly skilled at!)

Last Edited: Wed. Feb 22, 2017 - 01:16 PM
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Bronze Markawneil
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Posted by awneil: Wed. Feb 22, 2017 - 01:30 PM (Reply to #5)
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clawson wrote:
Just look at every phone, tablet and camera in your house and see what they are all using. End users like it when all the devices in the house use the same USB charging jack so they can mix and match chargers!

My point exactly

 

EDIT: forgot to say "with the notable exception of Apple who just want to irritate users" (something they seem particularly skilled at!)

Did they inherit that from Motorola?

 

My wife & I both had a succession of Motorola phones (before we got onto smartphones), and every single one had a different and incompatible charging connector!

 

angry

 

Even when they finally went to mini-USB, they managed to make it so that it wouldn't charge from just any mini-USB - it had to be specially designed for Motorola or, from a PC, had to have the Motorola driver installed.

 

angry

 

Top Tips:

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  2. "Garbage" characters on a serial terminal are (almost?) invariably due to wrong baud rate - see: https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/serial-communication
  3. Wrong baud rate is usually due to not running at the speed you thought; check by blinking a LED to see if you get the speed you expected
  4. Difference between a crystal, and a crystal oscillator: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
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  6. Beginner's "Getting Started" tips: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
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Howard_Smith
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Posted by Howard_Smith: Wed. Feb 22, 2017 - 01:38 PM
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clawson wrote:

Just look at every phone, tablet and camera in your house and see what they are all using. End users like it when all the devices in the house use the same USB charging jack so they can mix and match chargers! (well I do anyway)

 

EDIT: forgot to say "with the notable exception of Apple who just want to irritate users" (something they seem particularly skilled at!)

 

I'm actually an iPhone user, as is everyone in my household so I couldn't really do that ha! Though as far as I know, most smart phones that do use standard USB connectors do indeed use micro B.

I was more wondering if there was a set of rules/ guidelines that stated something like "if the device will be doing blah blah blah then it should feature a mini B connector, else if it's doing this n that then micro"

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Bronze Markawneil
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Posted by awneil: Wed. Feb 22, 2017 - 01:49 PM (Reply to #7)
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Howard_Smith wrote:
I was more wondering if there was a set of rules/ guidelines that stated something like "if the device will be doing blah blah blah then it should feature a mini B connector, else if it's doing this n that then micro"

No. It just historical:

 

First there was the "full-size" connector;

 

that became "too big", so they made the "mini" connector;

 

that, in turn, became "too big", so they made the "micro" connector.

 

So the micro is, effectively, the current "standard".

Top Tips:

  1. How to properly post source code - see: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment... - also how to properly include images/pictures
  2. "Garbage" characters on a serial terminal are (almost?) invariably due to wrong baud rate - see: https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/serial-communication
  3. Wrong baud rate is usually due to not running at the speed you thought; check by blinking a LED to see if you get the speed you expected
  4. Difference between a crystal, and a crystal oscillator: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  5. When your question is resolved, mark the solution: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  6. Beginner's "Getting Started" tips: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
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gchapman
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Posted by gchapman: Wed. Feb 22, 2017 - 02:11 PM (Reply to #2)
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Kartman wrote:
Full size type B are virtually impossible to pull off a pcb whereas ...

Industrial USB type B connector, up to 15 Newtons or 3.2 pounds

via

B&B Electronics

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http://www.bb-elec.com/Learning-Center/All-White-Papers/USB/Ruggedizing-USB-Connections-for-Tough-Environments.aspx

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Kycon

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http://www.mouser.com/search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=0virtualkey0virtualkeyKUSBXHT-BS1N-O-HRF 

 

"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller

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JoniS
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Posted by JoniS: Wed. Feb 22, 2017 - 02:17 PM
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awneil wrote:
So the micro is, effectively, the current "standard".

I would say this is going to change pretty quickly, type-c connector is more than likely going to take over, just because you can plug it in on one attempt every single time even in dark.

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Gold Markclawson
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Posted by clawson: Wed. Feb 22, 2017 - 04:37 PM
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awneil wrote:
My wife & I both had a succession of Motorola phones (before we got onto smartphones), and every single one had a different and incompatible charging connector!
yet the last two phones I've bought have both been Moto G's (loving the large screen G4 now!) and they have the "standard" (micro B) connector.

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gchapman
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Posted by gchapman: Wed. Feb 22, 2017 - 05:51 PM (Reply to #11)
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clawson wrote:
... Moto G's (loving the large screen G4 now!) ...

The Independent

The likes of Nokia, Sony and LG are expected to launch their newest flagship handsets

by Aatif Sulleyman

February 8, 2017

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/features/mwc-2017-nokia-samsung-sony-when-is-it-times-dates-what-will-happen-latest-a7570266.html

The world's biggest phone show takes place later this month, and there's a lot to look forward to

...

 

Motorola

...

It’s likely to expand the fantastic G line by launching the new G5 at MWC at 4.30pm CET on 26 February.

...

If the next Moto phone is anywhere near as enticing a package as the sub-£200 G4 though, consumers should be excited.

 

...

P.S.

The Independent

Nokia 3310, 'the most reliable phone ever made', to be re-launched at MWC 2017

by Andrew Griffin

16 February 2017

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/nokia-3310-mwc-2017-re-launch-buy-amazon-price-leaks-details-revealed-a7578941.html

The phone was first released in 2000 and some are still going strong

...

The new incarnation of the old 3310 will be sold for just €59, and so likely be pitched as a reliable second phone to people who fondly remember it the first time around.

...

Phones made under the Nokia brand are now sold by HMD Global, a Finnish company that bought the rights to the name. HMD will reveal other new mobiles – the Nokia 3, 5 and 6 – at the same MWC event.

Those other new phones wll be more like smartphones, but will retain much of the same low price.

 

"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller

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Simonetta
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Posted by Simonetta: Wed. Feb 22, 2017 - 11:48 PM
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I don't suggest EVER using the USB micro-B connector.   It is designed to have stain-relief supplied by a chassis housing surrounding the connector.  If the micro-B is soldered to the PCB (printed circuit board) only on one side, then it will very likely break off the first time that a USB cable is plugged into it.  

 

If you get a device with a USB micro-B connector, I recommend drilling 0.9mm holes on the left and right sides of it.  Then bend a paper clip around the top and bottom sides of the board surrounding the connector as tightly as you can.  Finally solder the paper-clip metal to the top of the connector.   This will add the stain-relief needed to keep the connector for popping off when a USB cable is inserted.   

 

Some micro-B connectors have through-hole tabs connected to the connector shell so that the connector is soldered to both sides of the PCB.  These have almost enough stain-relief to use casually. 

 

If you're designing with USB, try using the new USB-C format.   This is a "one size fits all" attempt on the part of the electronics industry to deal with the ridiculous USB connector situation.  

 

USB is a mess because in its attempt to be universal, it tries to replace everything from the old RS232 up to high-definition video linkages with the same cable and software format.   On the low end where us AVR developer Muggles live, having the new CH340G USB-serial ICs be available cheaply goes a long way to making USB reliable.  The older Prolific and FTDI USB-serial chips were nightmares with buggy Windows-version-incompatable drivers, clone-chip sabotage and subterfuge, and high prices.  Things are much better now that these bozos have passed from the scene.

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Bronze Markawneil
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Posted by awneil: Wed. Feb 22, 2017 - 11:59 PM (Reply to #13)
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Simonetta wrote:
the USB micro-B connector ...  is designed to have stain-relief supplied by a chassis housing

As an unqualified, general statement that is just rubbish.

 

Some specific models of USB micro-B connector may well be designed to have stain-relief supplied by a chassis housing - but that is not the general case.

 

FTDI USB-serial chips were nightmares with buggy Windows-version-incompatable drivers

I have never had any problems with FTDI chips or drivers.

 

The same cannot, sadly, be said of Prolific among others.

You definitely do get what you pay for!

 

 

Top Tips:

  1. How to properly post source code - see: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment... - also how to properly include images/pictures
  2. "Garbage" characters on a serial terminal are (almost?) invariably due to wrong baud rate - see: https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/serial-communication
  3. Wrong baud rate is usually due to not running at the speed you thought; check by blinking a LED to see if you get the speed you expected
  4. Difference between a crystal, and a crystal oscillator: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  5. When your question is resolved, mark the solution: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  6. Beginner's "Getting Started" tips: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
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ford2go
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Posted by ford2go: Sun. Feb 26, 2017 - 06:39 AM
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I have read that the micro connectors are supposed to withstand a large number of insertion cycles (forget just how many, but it's in the thousands, I believe).  Just from using them in various devices, I'm pretty sure that not everyone got the memo.

 

I never noticed that the minis were any more failure prone, but maybe they have an issue. Incidentally, if you're old and you have several devices, some of which use minis and some of which use micro, you will probably use profanity before getting everything to work :).

 

My issue with micros ( and probably minis as well) is that they seem to be spec'd for 30 ga wire. With chargers going towards 2 amps, this presents a limit on cable length due to voltage drop considerations. Same issue ( and probably a worse problem) on the famous Raspberry Pi. Why they didn't use a simple power connector like the Arduino does, I'll never know.

 

hj

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