AVR Freaks Projects page

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Hi All,

What's your opinion of the AVR Freaks Project page? What would you like to see different?

Who here has or maintains an active project on the AVR Freaks Project page? If you do, send me a PM or email...

(Oh! And Cliff and Johan are exempt from answering this thread. I've talked to them privately about this. :wink: )

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I just haven't done anything that seems significant enough to put there. Yet.

If you don't know my whole story, keep your mouth shut.

If you know my whole story, you're an accomplice. Keep your mouth shut. 

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Hi Eric,

I haven't got any project there either. However, I am fully supportive of its continuing existence as a source of learning for everyone. Whilst, the quality of some projects may sometimes not be "super-high", in the absence of any official collection of exemplary projects I think it should remain. There are some excellent contributions and I would hate to see these lost to the wider user base simply as a cost saving exercise (if that is what is behind your enquiry).

In the recent past, Stan and I have made some consistent efforts to weed out the rubbish and redirect the questions that are sometimes posted in the projects area. I am happy to continue doing so ... with the help of Dean and other behind the scenes Atmel "cleaners". We have in the past discussed the "Atmel employees only" limitation on how much we mere mortals can help beyond this notification activity, so will not repeat those arguments.

Cheers,

Ross

Ross McKenzie ValuSoft Melbourne Australia

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I have an AVR assembler AES encryption code project (PM sent).

I see a possible improvement? Maybe allowing the project author to include one "official" AVRfreaks thread link on the project page, as a dedicated easy to find comment/discussion about the project. Anyone that finds a project could click this project page link and instantly go to the "official" thread about the project that was started by the project author. Having a mechanism in place to put this special link on the project page would encourage project authors to do this.

This link should probably be limited to just the AVRfreaks forums, to avoid the risk of links to off site SPAM or unacceptable content. Any off site links would have to be in the "official" AVRfreaks project thread content. Then any problems or complaints about any "official" project thread content would be managed by the admins just like any other thread. This way it would not create a new different type of management workload for the admins.

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In addition to the Projects Secton, I also like Post Photos of your AVR Projects, Part II .

It allows one to see a large number of projects, PCBs, cases, etc., without the designer needing to do a formal write up.

It would be good to start Part III, as the current thread is gettng quite long.

Back On Topic:
In addition to the above it would be helpful if there was a way to index the projects based upon some general categories, letting the designer select all that are appropriate for the project.

Such categories might include such things as:
Tiny, Mega, Xmega
Digital Sampling
Audio output
Fats file system
Non-Fats File systems
Liner power supplies
Switching power supplies
RF
WiFi
Bluetooth
XBee
Nordic
Multiplexed LED display
DMA
Event System
USART comms
I2C comms
Ultrasound
GPS
GLCDs
Video generation
Video processing
FFT/DFT
PID control
Accelerometers
Magnetometers
SD Card interfacing
External FRAM usage
USB communications, Internal
USB communications, FTDI...
USB communications, VUSB (software USB)
Microcontroller Basics, (Flashing LEDs, Debouncing switches, etc.)
etc.

One might also include the ability to tag the project by the language used.

JC

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I've got a couple of projects posted. I was very careful to ensure they were complete - including documentation - before posting. I've always treated the projects section as 'you might find this useful' rather than 'look what I've done'.
Both my projects have off-freaks links to further documentation, which I'd hope aren't considered spammy.

I do hope that it's not 'let go'. It's part of this community. 1700 projects equates to a lot of knowledge. Sorting / Searching improvements would certainly be welcome. It'd be interesting to see what the highest ranked / most downloaded projects were, and might encourage higher quality submissions.

Personally, I found microcarl's serial backpack project a fantastic launching-pad for me when I was getting started with AVRs.

For 'look what I've done', I too like the Post Photos of your projects thread.

Nigel Batten
www.batsocks.co.uk

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I always wished it was a lot easier to view/browse the projects. A search for 'digital filter' gives a lot of projects, but one is in cv, one in gcc. I'm looking for one in icc. Wouldnt it be great to be able to look at each file in an explorer style tree and see if it clicks and is readable and understandable before downloading and unzipping? There is some amazing stuff in there hidden away. Needs to be a lot more searchable somehow. Maybe just put it all in a readonly directory and just browse it with ftp.

Imagecraft compiler user

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Don't worry everyone: we are definitely NOT getting rid of projects.

For those who have sent me a PM, or have indicated that they have projects, I will be emailing you a little later today. :)

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I've sent Mike B and Jim (jgmdesign) an email, as they've sent me a PM about their projects.

Let me know what you think. ;)

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condemned wrote:
I've got a couple of projects posted. I was very careful to ensure they were complete - including documentation - before posting. I've always treated the projects section as 'you might find this useful' rather than 'look what I've done'.
Both my projects have off-freaks links to further documentation, which I'd hope aren't considered spammy.

I do hope that it's not 'let go'. It's part of this community. 1700 projects equates to a lot of knowledge. Sorting / Searching improvements would certainly be welcome. It'd be interesting to see what the highest ranked / most downloaded projects were, and might encourage higher quality submissions.

Personally, I found microcarl's serial backpack project a fantastic launching-pad for me when I was getting started with AVRs.

For 'look what I've done', I too like the Post Photos of your projects thread.

Hi Nigel,

Which projects do you have on the Projects page?

Eric

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I think I've got 11 projects posted. Where's my gold plated email? :)

Chuck Baird

"I wish I were dumber so I could be more certain about my opinions. It looks fun." -- Scott Adams

http://www.cbaird.org

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EW wrote:
Which projects do you have on the Projects page?

"TellyMate - Serial to TV adapter" and
"XTV - XMega TV output"

Nigel Batten
www.batsocks.co.uk

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For a while I was trying to maintain some updates to AVR910 https://www.avrfreaks.net/index.p...

I guess now it's pretty much useless.

John Samperi

Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.

www.ampertronics.com.au

* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly

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zbaird wrote:
I think I've got 11 projects posted. Where's my gold plated email? :)

Let me know which projects... Either here or via email.

:wink:

Eric

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Emails out to Nigel and John.

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Email out to Chuck. Even marked as "High Importance". ;)

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Would I be right in thinking that everyone involved here was part of the previous Freaks "beta test" and has access to the "Beta Forum"? If so can I suggest we move there while what Eric is talking about is still beta to discuss it more openly.

I've been having a "play" with some of the toys on the site and have feedback which may be useful for others to know about.

Or, Eric, is it OK to discuss experiences with it openly here in this thread?

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Cliff,

Not sure if I qualify to be a member of the "everyone involved here" collective ... so feel free to ignore me if it expedites the discussion. :lol:

Cheers,

Ross

Ross McKenzie ValuSoft Melbourne Australia

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Quote:

Would I be right in thinking that everyone involved here was part of the previous Freaks "beta test" and has access to the "Beta Forum"?

No, you would be wrong (if "involved here" refers to early testers of the new site).

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

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Hi Cliff,

Not everyone here was involved with the previous beta test.

But I would be ok with discussing experiences here.

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OK then things I found so far (which I'll just lisit in case it helps/saves time for others):

1) Eric is on the case but be warned that the email you use will be public if you are the author of a project that is made publically visible. When anyone accesses your project there's a "Developer Info" to the right and under that your name. Clicking on that reveals various details including your email address so be very wary about what address you give when you first sign up. If you have one you keep for "junk" use then use that until this hole is plugged. The email is presented as:

someone @nospam@ somedomain.co.uk

Where the spaces and @nospam are supposed to iobfuscate it for spam bots but I think they are wise to the "nospam" thing.

2) If you post a project then while you can see everything while logged in try logging out and see if you can still see it. By default you won't be able (and nor will anyone else) because (as it does actually say on the very opening page) projects are made all private by default so you have to go to Admin then "Edit Observer Preferences" and switch some/all to be "Public" for it to show up.

3) There appears to be a fault in the Wiki if you choose to add one to your project pages. You can edit the opening (and other existing) pages no problem but it says that to create a new one you just put a "camel case" entry such as MyOtherPage in one of the pages and then that will become a link and when you click that link you can then edit the text of that new page and so on. My experience is that the new page is completely blank with no edit controls visible so you can add lots of blank pages but nothing more.

4) When registering UK users will find "United Kingdom" at the very bottom of the list after "Zimbabwe" ;-)

5) I use Hotmail - it put the registration confirmation email into "Junk". So if you think you haven't got a response after a while (and this bit happened in seconds in fact) the chances are your email/ISP junk filtered it.

6) As Eric will confirm the idea of this is not just like Projects in Freaks for finished/documented projects but you even get the option to say "just an idea at this stage" when starting something - maybe to invite discussion or to look for collaboration.

7) I guess others may choose to use one of the different code control systems offered but I use SVN and specifically TortoiseSVN as the Windows front end. If you do this then have the site create a default repository then you can either use an existing directory or create a new one and put some files you may already have into it. Now right click the directory name and on the context menu use "SVN Checkout...". Give the URL the spaces.atmel.com site told you such as "http://spaces.atmel.com/svn/proj...". The next dialog will ask for your user ID and password that you have registered/logged on with at the spaces.atmel.com site and then it'll say "there are files in this directory do you really way to checkout?". Use the "do it anyway" option. Later in explorer you can select the files with blue questions marks (just the source ones - not intermediate build output files) then on the TortoiseSVN sub-menu use Add... and finally use TortoiseSVN-Commit... and it will upload the first snapshot of those files into the repository. From then on you edit the files and when you reach a good stopping point you just select them again and "Commit" and that writes the second revision and so on...

8) When creating a project you are asked for "Project Unix Name". It does say "laphanumeric". This really cannot contain ' ' or '_' and will (amongst other things) be used to create the SVN project URL.

9) "Homepage URL" is optional and is a chance to give an http:// link to a web page outside of "spaces" that may also have info about the project - just leave it blank if no such URL exists.

10) under "licence" please don't just select GPL - think about it. GPL is quite the worst licence to use - don't be a sheep!

11) When you try to start a project it looks like it does go for manual approval so there could be a delay before that one comes back so do expect a delay.

12) err....

13) ....that's it for now.

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Quote:
5) I use Hotmail - it put the registration confirmation email into "Junk
I used the same adddress as I use here but can't see the confirmation email anywhere. Will look again.

John Samperi

Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.

www.ampertronics.com.au

* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly

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Look in your spam folder. Cliff said that his confirmation email got filtered.

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I looked everywhere again today. :-) Can you see if the email was sent?

John Samperi

Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.

www.ampertronics.com.au

* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly

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Never mind :oops: it was in the junk folder but I forgot which address I had used. All is well now.

John Samperi

Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.

www.ampertronics.com.au

* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly

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A side note on SVN:

Above, Cliff talks about creating a working copy "over" an existing directory tree (or, if you wish "checking out over an existing directory tree"). That is a nice technique sometimes.

There is also a specific SVN command that might be better in some cases: IMPORT.

For anyone seriously interested in Subversion, the free SVN book is a must: http://svnbook.red-bean.com/

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

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Quote:

There is also a specific SVN command that might be better in some cases: IMPORT.

Tortoise users are constrained to what's offered on the TortoiseSVN context menu (which may be a good thing ;-))

One thing that personally I would prefer not to have had happen is that the default SVN repository created for me on the Spaces site has the typical:

/ -+- tags/
   +- branches/
   +- trunk/

structure. I don't actually want this. I like things simple and would have preferred:

/

alone. If I want to set up a branches/trunk structure then I'd prefer to get the choice myself rather than having this dumped upon me.

But if it is going to be I guess I should have checked out:

http://spaces.atmel.com/svn/projname/trunk/

on top of my directory of existing files.

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Quote:

Quote:

There is also a specific SVN command that might be better in some cases: IMPORT.

Tortoise users are constrained to what's offered on the TortoiseSVN context menu (which may be a good thing Wink)


If your Tortoise context menu does not contain an Import.. item then it is broken (or some kind of pilot error is at hand).

SVN actually has a rather small set of commands. THAT is A Good Thing [tm]. TortoiseSVN offers more or less all operations present in the command line interface to SVN - and since that set is small this is also A Good Thing [tm].

Attachment(s): 

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

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You are of course quite correct. In my defence though I'll point out that it is fairly unusual to access the TortoiseSVN context menyu on a directory that is not version controlled (only when first adding) and the "normal" view has a lot of options but not import... which is why I didn't remember it being exposed...

Attachment(s): 

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clawson wrote:
Quote:

There is also a specific SVN command that might be better in some cases: IMPORT.

Tortoise users are constrained to what's offered on the TortoiseSVN context menu (which may be a good thing ;-))

One thing that personally I would prefer not to have had happen is that the default SVN repository created for me on the Spaces site has the typical:

/ -+- tags/
   +- branches/
   +- trunk/

structure. I don't actually want this. I like things simple and would have preferred:

/

alone. If I want to set up a branches/trunk structure then I'd prefer to get the choice myself rather than having this dumped upon me.

But if it is going to be I guess I should have checked out:

http://spaces.atmel.com/svn/projname/trunk/

on top of my directory of existing files.

Cliff, you are probably in the minority on this. You'll want to have the /tags directory when you start tagging your repo. You'll want to have the /branches directory, when you start branching. If you don't use those features you can ignore them and put it into trunk.

I was hoping to hear about comparisons between the old way of doing things, and the new way of doing things. Is that an improvement?

If there are things that are seriously wrong and shouldn't be done then, yes, that should be pointed out (like you have). But if they are just nitpicks... :roll:

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Quote:

If you don't use those features you can ignore them and put it into trunk.

that's the point - I know I don't want those features. I cannot see a handful of files in an AVR project getting so complex that I'd need to branch into separate development paths and again I don't see much ponit in tags - just remember that revision 137 is issue V1.0 and so on.

I agree I'm probably in a minority of one on this though and it's a "nitpick". It's just I don't like software systems dictating how I work. I like to decide how to work then configure the software system appropriately.

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If the conventional trunk/tags/branches organization does not fit your needs it takes 1 minute to dump it.

Quote:
just remember that revision 137 is issue V1.0 and so on.

Me too. But I need somewhere to note it, since my memory is not that good. And I prefer to have that note as close to the source code as possible.. (yeah, you know where I'm going.. :wink:)

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

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Quote:

(yeah, you know where I'm going.. Wink)

I thought you were going to say "Samples"' file releases system ;-)

BTW "Samples" is a pretty transitory name - almost every page on the system actually uses "gforge" as the sub-domain name,

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Where I was going: Use the tags branch in SVN repos to remember what revision was version x.y of the software.

Quote:
I thought you were going to say "Samples"' file releases system

I totally lost you there. "Samples"?

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

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"Samples", "Spaces" - same meat, different gravy :oops:

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clawson wrote:
... and again I don't see much ponit in tags - just remember that revision 137 is issue V1.0 and so on.

What about people using your project? Are they going to read your mind? Are they going to remember? What if you abandon the project? Or, heaven forbid, die? Will "revision 137 = V1.0" be on your tombstone? Or in your will?

That is the whole point of having tags, to y'know, tag your project so others know exactly what V1.0 is. If you don't branch, then you have nothing in your /branch directory.

If you want to dictate the layout of the SVN directories, I'm sure there are ways to do that. We can look into it.

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Quote:

If you want to dictate the layout of the SVN directories, I'm sure there are ways to do that.

Of-course. Since TortoiseSVN seems to be the preferred UI for SVN then look no longer than to the Repo Browser. Caution: Anything done in the Repo Browser takes immediate effect, any Repo Browser op ends with an implicit commit, there will be no Undo available (you will of-course still have the option to return to an earlier revision).

Or else just go on the command line interface and do the "ordinary" DELETE op.

If we are just discussing the default repo layout here, I advocate that the SVN convention should be the default. I am in no way against having another structure, but most documentation talks in the context of the trunk/trags/branches structure, so it makes sense to have that as default.

And again, it takes less than a minute to remove it if you don't want it.

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

Last Edited: Tue. Oct 16, 2012 - 06:36 PM
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As I say I'm in a minority of one here so ignore me. I guess I can work with any dictated filesystem layout. As said above it doesn't take much to delete and instigate ones own preferred layout.

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Glad to NOT know what you lot are talking about... :lol:

Quote:
that's the point - I know I don't want those features.
I seem to vaguely remember saying something similar about something else around here, can't remember....

John Samperi

Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.

www.ampertronics.com.au

* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly

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Quote:

Glad to NOT know what you lot are talking about...

Ah then maybe I should write a tutorial about SVN for single user use? It really is a Godsend when you need to fallback or rebuild last Thursday's version of the code because your current "tinkering" has really screwed things and you cannot remember what it looked like last Thursday and what you have changed since.

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Now thats a great idea Clawson

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I'd be delighted to have the Idiot's Guide to SVN available.

Chuck Baird

"I wish I were dumber so I could be more certain about my opinions. It looks fun." -- Scott Adams

http://www.cbaird.org

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In that case we'll have to see what the Idiot can come up with ;-)

I've thought about this before but while I'm doing this stuff all the time and in any day probably hit one of most things (much larger 50+ engineer project) that you might want to do in SVN, trying to construct a sequenced list of examples for a small AVR project to show the facilities in turn could be tricky.

On the Spaces (I got the name right!) site I've created a project to do (yet another!) SD bootloader. Maybe what I'll do is make extensive use of that SVN and take snapshot screen dumps every time I interact as I go along and then see if I can paste these together into a properly structured tutorial at the end?

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Actually the horse's mouth is pretty good:
http://svnbook.red-bean.com/en/1...
Read ONLY chapter 1, then go look at:
http://tortoisesvn.net/

As a related question, I'm wondering why the Arduino folks are all using GitHub, I was under the impression that it is more difficult than SVN, but if those guys are using it, I have to wonder.

Smiley

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General consensus is that GIT is actually a "better" system than SVN. However (though the landscape is changing) things like Tortoise have simply made SVN the far easier one to use and because it's been around a lot longer it's widely used, there's lots of "expert knowledge" and lots of large projects relying on it. Lots of people have to get a familiarity with GIT though simply because this is how the Linux kernel is now maintained (Linus wrote Git).

While SVN/GIT are radically better than what preceded them and I'm an old luddite who generally prefers CLIs to GUIs the fact is that both are tortuous to operate at the command line (did I read that GIT has 140 commands?) so I'd find a solution that integrates with the file explorer in your operating system so you can just right click files and add/commit/update/whatever from an easy to use menu than having to remember some runic command invocation.

The SVN book you linked is all very well but even that is aimed (IMAO) at "power users" and is documenting the command line interface (though I know a lot of it is about the concepts rather than the detail). Also the vast majority of text on code control systems is done in the context of multi-person projects (where locking/merging become big issues) whereas what I had in mind is highlighting how these system actually offer a lot even to the "one man band" and lone hobbyist. In which case quite a lot of the "theory" is irrelevant for the sub-set of what they actually need to know about.

But as I just said to Chuck - it looks simple but trying to come up with "faked" usage scenarios to document why it is you need to get back to last Thursday's version are not actually that easy. So I think that documenting a real project where you make real reversions and so on would help to illustrate the use.

(and to Eric sorry for slight off-topic but I think use of SVN/GIT is kind of a key part of the GForge thing so the more people who start using it and presenting their projects in that way the better).

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As a related question, I'm wondering why the Arduino folks are all using GitHub

Git is a distributed revision control system. Those are especially suited for large, across-the world development efforts. The two other contenders for the throne in distributed revision control kingdom are Mercurial (a.k.a "Hg") and Bazaar (a.k.a. "Bz"). Git seems to be the strongest candidate for the throne - it is used by such dominating and large projects as the Linux kernel, the Android smartphone OS and more. (Dean will hate me for this but... it sure wins the contest for largest set of subcommands - 140 or so :shock:). Nevertheless, there are large projects using the two other major DRCSes, too.

If I am not misinformed, both Hg and Bz can check out from a SVN repo. I am guessing that Git can to.

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

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the fact is that both are tortuous to operate at the command line

I disagree re SVN. There are 10 or less subcommands that you need to handle as an ordinary user in everyday ops. They follow a very stringent syntax, reflecting the "model" behind SVN - a versioned file system.

No not a file system full of files with different versions, a complete file system existing in a number of versions (the correct word in SVN speak is "revisions")). This is a key concept in SVN - every time you do a commit (be it of one single file) a new revision of the complete file system is the result.

Most subcommands in SVN have parameters/options that talk of the revision and a path into the file system, or a path to something in your working copy.

From the top of my head, here are the subcommands you need to know on a command line: checkout (co), commit (ci), update (up), add, del, diff, stat, log, resolve, move, copy.

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Actually the horse's mouth is pretty good

Nope. It's really good.

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

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I disagree re SVN. There are 10 or less subcommands that you need to handle as an ordinary user in everyday ops. They follow a very stringent syntax, reflecting the "model" behind SVN - a versioned file system.

I'm talking about things like a commit. I usually want to enter several paragraphs of text to explain what's just been changed, why and my justification for doing so there's no way I'm going to be using:

svn commit dataflash.c -m "The potted works of shakespeare condensed into ten paragraphs ...."

In Tortoise I select the file(s), right click then "Commit..." and enter my wordy description in the dialog box that appears. The same comment being applied to three directories and 10 individual files I had selected when I started. I don't even want to think how I would have to go about listing all those items in some command line invocation!

As an example here's a typical check-in comment:

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http://bugzilla.fel/show_bug.cgi...
Improvements in high-level functionality to filter out "wild" results.
Improvements in feature selection
Change of CTU_CAR_DATA to be CARD_INFO and VID_INFO
(switch off test mode for SimuGUI build of SAW interacting software)
Header file changes reflect new/changed function names and add current_principal_pt fields to the CLUSTER structure
min/max vector angles/magnitudes now held as float not IQ20

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Oh.. You're breaking one of the principles I teach re SVN:

Generally, do not check in "cherry-picked" files. Check in everything you have changed. If possible. Try to avoid to have several "working tasks" in one and the same WC at any one time.

NEVER check in more than "one thing" at a time. E.g. it kills traceability.

The above is all IMO - you are free to disagree :D

Re entering a long commit comment you can set SVN to start your favourite editor for this (and since the comment does not go for each individual file, but for the one new revision of the file system it will be needed to be entered only once).

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

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Check in everything you have changed.

I always do that - a commit is atomic - you don't want to make a commit in parts or the next person may only end up with half of it if my 2nd commit failed.

We always commit "one change" at a time. But one change could be "a rewrite of the object detector" which could actually be a large chunk in fact - there was one change (an architectural thing involving a switch around of the hardware used) someone made that affected about 50 directories and 300 files. But it was just one change. The description of what had changed and the side effects in various places in the checkin comment was HUGE! Sure we actually put most of the documentation of PRs and CRs in the Bugzilla so that is much more wordy but there's nothing worse than browsing SVN and just finding a Bugzilla URL and nothing more against a revision. That forces you to go off sifting through Bugzilla as well so a neat summary of it in SVN is very welcome.

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Check in everything you have changed.

I always do that

Then I lost you. In such a case you do not need to mention/pick individual files. Just do a COMMIT on the WC directory.

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

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