In the thread Eric started there seemed to be a suggestion that a revamped Freaks might be linked to social media sites such as Facebook, Twitter, LinkedIn, etc.
Just wondered what people's views were on this.
Just vote here - add comments to Eric's thread.
Article: Social Networking corrals 72 percent of U.S. adults:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3...
So at most you'd stand to lose 28% of freaks? Wonder which ones?
I know that Cliff didn't want the discussion here, but since the other thread isn't focused entirely on social media I thought I'd comment here.
I'm seriously in the 'what's social media' column. To me the fact that 72% of the public is on social media doesn't mean a lot. What percent of those are engineers or folks who what to learn about AVRs or would purchase Atmel products?
I don't want to oppose social media just because I'm old and set in my ways, I'd really like a good reason to use any of it and all my investigations to date says it is mostly a time sump for folks pretending to be busy. I seriously don't have a lot of extra time. Yeah, I've got enough to waste here on occasion, but I can also learn a lot here so here I am. Forums have made sense to me since back in the pre-Internet days of dial up bulletin boards. You get to communicate directly on a specific topic. The other stuff just seems like a sort of personal billboard for putting up all your 'ain't I great' stuff. I'm probably not understanding it properly.
Facebook makes sense to me for keeping track of a small group of friends or family, but I don't see the business connection. I can see how twitter might make sense for some businesses were folks need to check in several times a day, but for individuals it just seems like a kind of vanity. LinkdIn, yes if I'm in the job market, which I'm not, or want to keep track of former colleagues, which I don't.
Maybe somebody can explain to me why they use any of that in the context of using Atmel products. What am I missing?
But I also think that any social media added on here would likely be harmless. I can't imagine how any of it would be implemented to force anyone to use it. Atmel already has a Facebook page and a twitter feed - neither of which I have any personal use for - so I can ignore it here as well as there. And as long as it has an optional nature to it, I say go for it. It might help those folks who like those kinds of things and I don't see how it could hurt those of us who don't think we need it. Maybe if some of it is implemented here, some of us might even find a use for it and move into the 21st century. Or not.
Smiley
+1 with Smiley only because isn't AVRfreaks essentially 'social media' but for a niche market?
You think the moderators have enough to do making sure the threads do not get hostile/nasty/bullying already?
Or keeping threads 'On-Topic'? How would the whole 'Friends' work? Or Twitter with the name calling crap etc...
My 'friends' on Facebook could not give a rats ***hair about who I know in Atmel Land. They are too busy uploading iphone videos of their kids potty training or an instagram of a beach bash I am glad I was not invited to.
Let's keep AVRfreaks the nice closed society that we all have become addicted to in our own special way :)
EDIT: I just noticed Smiley's slight concession about a little social media seeping in here. I guess there's hope for our favorite surly curmudgeon after all :lol:
Well, since the Social Media comments seem to be accumulating here, not in the other Thread...
Of course I could cross post on both Threads!
I think Atmel needs to do Facebook, Twitter, etc., for the college students / future engineers and programmers.
It is the "norm" for them.
I doubt many older engineers & programmers will be attracted as new members to the AVR Freaks family because of social media connections.
I don't care if the new forum has social media connections as long as it is not obtrusive for those who don't wish to be bothered with that aspect of the site.
I have a Linked In account, and use it infrequently. For most people I need to touch base with I already have their eMail address through other means.
JC
I would not do it.
For a starter when going on facebook there will have to be a number of people that are watching 24/7 what is posted. You need to have people 24/7 that are accepting new followers. For short: a number of Atmel employees will be needed to keep things going and under control. It will be a lot more work than Atmel has put in the last few years in the freaks forum. As such this will mean that Atmel will set things up and then because they have to keep spending money will pull the plug again.
Atmel on Facebook , fine
A freaks group on Facebook fine, but dont link this great going forum to the facebook stuff. You will need to find people that will run the show and keep it running and seeing what has happened to the few Atmel employees that came here and decided to help make this forum better.... I guess that in the end it will be a mess and thus giving Atmel a bad name...
Be ware that when opening such facebook account you will also have to have people answering questions there.
and as said Facebook is for people that want to look busy, but in the end wasting their time on keeping their followers happy....
Keep in mind that this forum is for enthusiasts, run by enthusiasts and not a student that would like his home work done by others, to me it seems like Atmel has lost that view.
+1 for smiley, with the exception that I think that adding social media here will not be harmless. It will attract more students who want their homework done and as such might scare of real enthustaists and people that come here for years and that are not allowed to say anything about it, because we have to be nice all the time. Just imagine 30 post per day that are only questions like "please give me the code to ......" then you have 30 replies "won't do that, do your own homework" in the end people will dislike Atmel for having such bad forum (as students will be the first to put the 'non helpfull' avrfreaks forum/facebook all over the place) so it might as well back fire in the end.....
just keep the 2 seperated (forum and social media), advertise on social media about the existence of this forum, but don't mix.
I agree. And example of such forum is http://www.edaboard.com. In theory it is big forum with a large crowd of people, but a lot of topics are students looking for someone to do their homework, many threads die with one or no replies.
Social Networking corrals 72 percent of U.S. adults
----------
Social networking is for short messages of little long-term value. I see AVRfreaks as a technical forum, where there are more lengthy discussions of (hopefully) longer-term value (at least ocasionally :wink:).
If Atmel wants SN, fine. Do that. On the social networks. Don't turn AVRfreaks into an instagram-like pile of non tech stuff.
AVRfreaks value isn't in marketing as I see it, but in "after-marketing".
----------
If you want to do stuff with AVRfreaks, how about stopping us getting CAPTCHAs for stuff that does not need it? I just got one for this post.. :roll:
Eric, if the UK also has 72% on social networking sites then I would be one of them. I use twitter and Facebook daily and LinkedIn from time to time but I use that for contact with family and friends (ok, maybe not LinkedIn). In my opinion it has absolutely no place on a site such as Freaks which is professional and technical. Would anyone here really care that last night I posted on Facebook that I'd just found a new Indian takeaway and eaten the best Indian meal I ever ate? (I did and it was wonderful!).
Well, I can't remember how many cups of tea that I have enjoyed or recommended to AvrFreaks!
David.
Whatever changes you make , don't have an OFF TOPIC section in the revamped forum. Just imagine all the young kiddies who will become offended if a slightly risqué comment is made, or even worse, god forbid, the melt down that will occur should some irresponsible person mention the latest school massacre and it gets out on SM. Us oldies won't be able to handle it! :(
It must be just me but I find the "like" thing on Facebbok infantile at best, but mostly ridiculous.
Now if Facebook implemented a HATE button then I would be all for that, it's not for nothing that I have aquired a senior's card which gives me the governmental right to be grumpy and hate everything whenever I feel like it!
it's not for nothing that I have aquired a senior's card which gives me the governmental right to be grumpy and hate everything whenever I feel like it!
+1 I hit the big 65 in two weeks time!
Well mine it's a senior's card (60+) not a pensioner's card (65+). :wink:
Article: Social Networking corrals 72 percent of U.S. adults:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3...
I'm not a heavy user, being a geezer and all. But when I use social media, it is for ... SOCIAL ... purposes.
I frequent a couple of Facebook pages that have probably "moderate" traffic. I looked at them, and couldn't figure out how I might find past information discussing e.g. pinchange on Mega165. Perhaps it is just my geezerishness not knowing how to operate?
The LinkedIn Atmel AVR Developers thing is kind of interesting. Will/would it be useful for "full" support threads with attachments for pictures/files such as the extensive Forum threads?
I'll re-iterate: Will it be able to incorporate the invaluable archives of the past dozen years of 'Freaks Forum threads? That is IMO the most important part of 'Freaks. What is left after that consists of announcements and the plethora of "getting temperature displayed on an LCD display" questions.
I also frequent a FEW Facebook pages, but they are pages of real friends. Purely social. I have yet to find a business or technical one that was useful enough to warrant the effort.
I see business sites as one way operations. Is there a new product? Has Application Note XYZ been updated? Is the company going to have something at ABC-CON? Where is the next Word Tour going?
I have yet to find any of these sites that helped me solve a problem. Or, make a better component choice or cut the BOM cost. Or, tell me how to solve a pointer problem in C. AVR Freaks? All the time, baby, all the time (with huge thanks to all of the contributors).
I have an idea: Put the first page or two of Atmel's web site on Facebook., Remove that crap from the web site and get us right to the juicy stuff.
Jim
In the OFF-Topic area there was a sticky IIRC of POST A PIC OF YOUR RECENT PROJECT Some neat stuff there. MAybe turn the off topic forum int a more social driven adventure with a 'menu' of sorts like "Ross' Friday funny", The projects pictures, Announcements of All things Atmel, Maker Faires, Magazine articles etc.
Run a 'Make Smiley smile' contest. Winner gets an ICE200(duck!!) :lol:
Just a thought
My wife and I only use FB to coordinate the social activities of our very large family (cousins and their offspring, etc).
And Jim, I am happy with the current level of my Friday contributions. Please don't obligate me to more than that. Please! That is not funny.
So where is your inaugural contribution to the "Make Smiley Smile" thread? :lol:
Cheers,
Ross
I have a congenital skin condition that prohibits the facial motion necessary to smile (Basset Hound Droop Syndrome). However, I can think of a couple of people here you can kill for me, and I'll use my fingers to hold my lips in a fairly reasonable simulation of a smile (though I will also drool a bit). I'll post pictures of my smile after you post pictures of the corpses. And you have to figure out who the victims should be. I'll smile when you get it right.
Smiley
Now that is funny!
and couldn't figure out how I might find past information discussing e.g. pinchange on Mega165.
https://www.facebook.com/AtmelCo...
(and a few other "Atmel" variants on FB) where I have seen the odd question along the lines of 165 pin-changes. However I only looked at that FB page a couple of times because @Atmel tweeted at one point that they wanted to get their "Likes" number over 100,000 - so I did (it's a bit sad when you have to ask for friends isn't it!). I'm guessing not many Freaks read that (or other Atmel pages on FaceBook) regularly? And that's kind of the point.
I assume that the possible integration of FB/Twitter in a new Freaks might look something a bit like this:
http://dangerousprototypes.com/2...
that has FB and Twitter "buttons" towards the top of the page. Presumably the idea is that you read something stupendous on Freaks (or dangerous prototypes or wherever) and think it is so earth shattering you must tell all your friends and family. So you click the button and make an FB or Twitter post about it with a link?
I'm scratching around trying to think which members of my family would actually be interested in something I've read/seen on Freaks ... err, no, I've got nothing so far.
I see nothing wrong with Atmel asking you to follow (or even Like!) them on FB or Twitter on some new site but I couldn't see a point in it being like one of those really annoying sites that hovers FB/Twitter buttons down the side of whatever page you are reading expecting you to "publish" it to friends and family. Something like this:
(buttons on the left and at top right as you scroll). That kind of thing is intensely annoying. As a search for "how to add FB/Twitter buttons" shows it's all about e-commerce. It's not about "being social".
Social networks are for socialising. Only the kind of people who frequent the comic store in Big Bang Theory really have a social group who'd be remotely interested how they implemented that 15 cycle floating point multiply routine! My granny, mum, aunt, sister, brother, nephew, niece just aren't interested in my geekiness.
My apologies if I offended you Ross and Joe.
No problems Jim... obviously I forgot the :lol:. I am embarrassed that you would consider my frivolous contributions as worthy for anything even worth mentioning. But maybe tomorrow's will fill the bill...
Quote:and couldn't figure out how I might find past information discussing e.g. pinchange on Mega165.
There is this:
In the OFF-Topic area there was a sticky IIRC of POST A PIC OF YOUR RECENT PROJECT Some neat stuff there.
+1, (Well +100, really)
Don't wish to lose this with the new forum.
It is intriguing and educational to see how others have tackled embedded projects.
JC
What I meant was, I don't know how to search Facebook to find all references to e.g. Mega165.
BTW if I go to FaceBook and search "ATmega128" (I thought it could be a popular search term) then the result is a little disappointing, Facebook effectively cops out and just shows me results from Bing (why Bing and not Google goodness knows!). I don't think there is a way to thread search or, rather "timeline search" to find every public mention of atmega168.
By the way, for all practical purposes, AVR Freaks IS more of a "social media" than anything else I regularly use. It is certainly social (its been so for a long time, but even more with the Off Topic forum). There is a regular community of folks who "know" each other about as well as you can on-line.
I really fail to see what something like FaceBook would add! How could I solve my oscillator problem faster with a link to FaceBook? How could I get an answer about C pointers or PROGMEM strings easier with FB there? How could I get my regular fix of Ross's Friday Humor (or is it Humour?) in any better style?
Jim
I don't think there is a way to thread search or, rather "timeline search" to find every public mention of atmega168.
ISWYM but I don't think there's a suggestion that Freaks would be hosted on Facebook,
While I know that a lot of you don't do the Social Media thing, there are people who are Atmel users and customers that do. I can't make any guarantees.
[Summary: For me, make a solid forum-like site. Keep it solid with regular care and feeding. Keep flash and splash down to a minimum--I guess I can live with the current "maximize". Make it a true support organ, with company support people monitoring and chiming in with responses to technical questions. TBD: Would that extend to "displaying the temperature on the LCD"? ]
that has FB and Twitter "buttons" towards the top of the page. Presumably the idea is that you read something stupendous on Freaks (or dangerous prototypes or wherever) and think it is so earth shattering you must tell all your friends and family. So you click the button and make an FB or Twitter post about it with a link?
Article: Social Networking corrals 72 percent of U.S. adults
My apologies if I offended you Ross and Joe.
And speaking of hijacking a thread. Freaks links to social media - why is this any different than it is on any other website with those links? I can ignore them here just as well as I ignore them there. They only take up a little bit of space usually at the bottom of the page. Folks who don't want to use them don't have too and folks who do want to use them have the opportunity. There are lots of different kinds of folks on the Internet and if some like that sort of thing, why is it a problem for those of who don't since we aren't forced to use it?
So 72% of us won't use it, is that any reason for the links to not be available to those who might? After all, it is the Atmel folks who will have to keep those other sites functioning, not us.
Smiley
Be grateful she does not tell you to roll over and play dead
This forum is attracting a lot of new people and I feel like many of the regulars are not very noob friendly.
May I suggest adding subforums for newbies, etc?
This forum is attracting a lot of new people and I feel like many of the regulars are not very noob friendly.
Once in a while some of us go off our regular feed and get funky. This usually happens around mid-terms, and school finals. While some of it can be a bit over zealous think of it as a wake up call to when they have a real job and sleeping at your desk until the last minute won't fly.
May I suggest adding subforums for newbies, etc?
See!!! was that so bad ;) :lol:
Anyway if we all get sick of the new forum we can always go bak to the text only avrchat Yahoo forum, perfect for grumpy ol' guys. (do ol' girls get grumpy too??)
It's been very quiet lately.
(do ol' girls get grumpy too??)
However, the Basset Hound Droop Syndrome is a real medical condition
I googled BHDS and got nil.
What I did find was Basset Tail Droop Syndrome. Where did your wife place the buisquit?? :wink:
I feel like many of the regulars are not very noob friendly.
OTOH I guess it depends what you mean by "not noob friendly". If you mean the answers given are too technical for the noob to understand I'm afraid there's probably not a lot can be done about that - microcontrollers and programming them is a complex business so it is going to require some dedication from a noob to learn. What is it someone once said? "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start.". Not sure where I read that but it sounds true ;-)
In addition, if refusing to provide a full solution to an obvious request for completing a "noob's" homework actually does qualify as "not being noob friendly", this would bias that statement quite heavily as well. Not everybody does have uncle Xyx's attitude of providing code just for anything that gets asked for whatever dubious reason.
I'm a noob (only been on the forum for a week). Everyone has been friendly to me. Even with some stupid idiotic mistakes in code they still assisted and asked for clarification.
What I do see in some of the "noob" posts is folks not providing clear information and/or showing any initiative to do the work themselves. If I know something (like how to make a 2 transistor rs232 level shifter) I will provide some pointers, but I won't do it for you. All the pushback I've seen from the curmudgeons is nothing more than telling folks to do a marginal amount of work on their own.
Then again, I'm a curmudgeon myself.
Luckily for me the membership requirements are quite relaxed. :P
I guess that I am an old fogey rather than a curmudgeon.
Yes, sometimes I get grumpy too.
We do try to distinguish between the genuine question and the "idle student". I try to point the student in a sensible direction. However, some horses fail to drink!
Regarding Facebook etc. I have no problem with small icons placed out of harm's way. Then it is a personal choice for the reader.
OTOH, I get very irritated by this:
http://www.farmersguardian.com/home/arable/us-harvest-will-be-crucial-to-grain-prices-experts-claim/57979.article?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=NLGeneral
If you are using a narrow window, the "BIG ICONS" obscure the article that you are trying to read.
Other websites place advertising links obtrusively. So that you inadvertently click on them.
IMHO, it is just a question of sensible web-page design. Provide an attractive page that conveys the information and is still pleasant to use.
The advertising will still be effective. For a start, you have not annoyed the prospective customer.
David.
OTOH, I get very irritated by this:
I looked at the link and thought "what's he on about?". Then I realised it was being suppressed by the NoScript add-on to Firefox. Once I turned that off I saw the annoying icons you are talking about so two things come out of this:
1) you may want use NoScript if you use FireFox (or it may even be a reason to start using Firefox) then you can have these things filtered out of your life forever.
2) if Atmel are to implement something like those annoying icons (which are what I too really hate about "social networking" icons and prompted this thread) then please, please implement it exactly how farmersguardian.com are doing it. That way we can all guarantee to be able to "turn it off" by the use of NoScript :-)
I looked at it with Apple Safari and didn't see what these comments are describing. There are three relatively small link icons up in the right corner. When I drag the window narrower, they slide inward until the window edge is just over the red search button, at which point, they disappear.
So, no biggie from them. However, this DOES point to the need to test web page layout and function with a wide variety of browsers.
Jim
I do use FireFox.
I do agree with Jim. i.e. web-designers should test pages with a wide variety of browsers.
Jim, on FireFox, you see 4 large icons on the left side of the page. They obscure the text on a regular window. They are unobtrusively in the margin if you have a full-screen window.
Yes, of course punters can turn features on or off if they make an effort. However, most will leave everything at their default. (I am a regular punter)
David.
OK, didn't notice the left ones. The right ones behaved as I described.
The left ones slide onto the content frame as I narrow the Safari window. When the view window just matches the content frame, the left ones also go away. There is a smallish region of view window width just barely wider than the content frame where the left ones do overlap onto content. Pretty annoying.
Again, it points out the need to check web page design under a wide variety of conditions. Not just browser, but window size, screen resolutions, content blockers or modifiers, and such.
Jim
Anyway....we may be getting all excited for nothing...we may have to keep the current forum for a long time yet, I'll believe it when I see it.
Oh and this is not just because we are here in the middle of a federal election when we get promised the world. :evil: Would that make a person even more cynical?
But Atmel proved me wrong with the availabilty of the XmegaE5 before, I challenge them to prove me wrong again with the forum!! :mrgreen:
So this is what happens on another site when you open a thread, both Facebook and Google + buttons appear.
What happens after someone does the infantile Like? Do all members get more spam posts or just the ones who choose to be linked to those sites? (good to know no one like my post!! :lol: )
AdBlock removes them nicely, so I did not even know they existed there. Now I might just miss them on the new forum as well. And I'll be happy about it.
I did not even know they existed there
So it looks like you can "like" a thread.
Ok, let's be clear about a few things. First, I will grant that "connected" to social media is vague. We certainly don't have any desire to "force" anyone to use social media if they don't want to. But we would like to help enable others to use it if they so desire.
I'm going to ask everyone hear to take a deep breath, and try to look at AVR Freaks from a bit of a different view...
You guys use social media. Right here on AVR Freaks. You just may not be aware of it. Let me point out a few things:
- There's an Off Topic forum where people can feel free to talk about non-technical subjects and connect to others throughout the world on personal subjects. There are whole websites devoted to this kind of stuff, you guys just co-opted a forum for this purpose.
- There's a thread where you can post pictures of your latest project and tell a little about what's going on. There are whole websites devoted to this kind of stuff, you guys just co-opted a forum thread for this purpose.
- There's a thread where you can post pictures of yourself, and let others see you instead of a small "avatar". There are websites devoted to this kind of stuff, you guys just co-opted a forum for this purpose.
- There's a forum where you post documentation and tutorials about how to do things. Again there are websites, and tools to do this. It's called a wiki. Yes, AVR Freaks has a wiki, and yes, everyone knows it's slow. Yes, you're right, you deserve a much better wiki to do this sort of thing. And again, you guys just co-opted a forum for this purpose.
- There's a forum thread where the Freaks in Melbourne Australia can keep track of when to meet in person. Again, there are websites devoted to this purpose and a forum thread was just co-opted for this purpose.
I could go on.
But look: you ARE social. You're just using good ol' forum threads to accomplish these other tasks where more dedicated tools might help.
Yes, we want to make sure that there is a great forum experience. And there's also more to an online life than just forums. We're seeing what can be done.
You guys use social media
Everytime I log into Facebook I get a barrage of "meet single women" ads pushed at me.
OK I'm an Italian latin lover but enough is enough!!
And no flashing stuff in front of your eyes in Maximised mode here.
edit and speak of the devil... I just got yet one more email from Linked in trying to get me linked with people I have NO IDEA who they are. And don't I love the constant "update your profile" from them too! :evil:
But look: you ARE social. You're just using good ol' forum threads to accomplish these other tasks where more dedicated tools might help.
Not being a big social media person, I'm most familiar with Facebook and somewhat with LinkedIn. I can't see that either of those sites would be well set up for storing/searching the archive of previous threads on a subject. (LinkedIn--maybe)
Quote:True, but AVRfreaks is not constantly pumping out "targeted" ads or mine for as much information as possible out of user.You guys use social mediaEverytime I log into Facebook I get a barrage of "meet single women" ads pushed at me.
OK I'm an Italian latin lover but enough is enough!!And no flashing stuff in front of your eyes in Maximised mode here.
edit and speak of the devil... I just got yet one more email from Linked in trying to get me linked with people I have NO IDEA who they are. And don't I love the constant "update your profile" from them too! :evil:
Nard
They are called Rosa, Sylvia, Tessa and Tina, You can find them https://www.linuxmint.com/
Dragon broken ? http://aplomb.nl/TechStuff/Dragon/Dragon.html for how-to-fix tips
I got irritated by LinkedIn
Wow. You guys get singularly focused on a bad experience in one place.
My point is that you like talking about your projects, and posting pictures of them. You like talking about what else goes on your life besides flipping bits in registers. You like helping out the new guys by writing tutorials. Some of you also like to meet up in real life.
Different websites serve different purposes.
Surely the purpose of these websites is to irritate the user with obtrusive adverts, discover your personal habits, and shower you with SPAM.
If the webpages are well written, they can be of benefit to participants and non-participants.
I suspect that once you open the door, we will all get flooded with personal emails for "becoming my FaceBook friend" or lover in the case of Mr Samperi.
David.
As I understand it you'd probably have social media link buttons somewhere on the site where they could be easily ignored by the troglodytes but used by those wanting them. Thus they would be essentially harmless to those of us afraid of them but usable by those who want to. I recently read somewhere that Facebook folks might click a Facebook like button and there will automatically be a like registered on their Facebook page that will be propagated to that persons friends if they have signed up for it. So potentially an engineering student could see a thread with something she likes and then by the click of a button tell all her friends who might them come here for a look see. I can see how this would have value to Atmel and how it wouldn't hurt the rest of us.
The main thing I think I'm seeing here is that a lot of us old farts don't know squat about social media and fear the unknown. I fully understand that folks with still functioning hormones seem to like social media and use it a lot, but I don't understand why. That may be a path to get the geezers here to back off. Somebody could tell us how social media is used by younger techies. Like the Facebook example I gave. Maybe Dean could explain why he uses twitter and how it helps him be a better twit? Seriously, get some young EE who uses this stuff to post a thread or tutorial on social media for engineers. Couldn't hurt?
Smiley
I think that Smiley has explained things perfectly.
I am terrified by the "unknown". And especially of being someone's "friend" when I have never met them.
David.
As I understand it you'd probably have social media link buttons somewhere on the site where they could be easily ignored by the troglodytes but used by those wanting them. Thus they would be essentially harmless to those of us afraid of them but usable by those who want to. I recently read somewhere that Facebook folks might click a Facebook like button and there will automatically be a like registered on their Facebook page that will be propagated to that persons friends if they have signed up for it. So potentially an engineering student could see a thread with something she likes and then by the click of a button tell all her friends who might them come here for a look see. I can see how this would have value to Atmel and how it wouldn't hurt the rest of us.The main thing I think I'm seeing here is that a lot of us old farts don't know squat about social media and fear the unknown. I fully understand that folks with still functioning hormones seem to like social media and use it a lot, but I don't understand why. That may be a path to get the geezers here to back off. Somebody could tell us how social media is used by younger techies. Like the Facebook example I gave. Maybe Dean could explain why he uses twitter and how it helps him be a better twit? Seriously, get some young EE who uses this stuff to post a thread or tutorial on social media for engineers. Couldn't hurt?
Smiley
Where can I "Like" this post?
Can't we get a forum where I can vote on these things! :wink:
Maybe Dean could explain why he uses twitter and how it helps him be a better twit?
I use it because I enjoy complaining. But seriously, I originally used it for quick project updates ("New beta release", "oh god everything's on fire", etc.) and now use it as a quick brain-dump. Less so nowadays that Twitter is becoming aggressively anti-developer, meaning no RSS feeds, can't even access your own feed remotely without an API key.
Facebook: don't have it, don't want it. Tried it once, never again.
LinkedIn: signed up recently at the behest of my parents, believe it to be largely useless spam generator so far.
Facebook "Like" and other buttons are great; willingly injecting Facebook's code into arbitrary sites gives them a fantastic way to deliver targeted advertising to you everywhere you go. Thankfully I have industrial strength blockers to remove them all, but it's still irksome that I had to do it in the first place.
Essentially: For me 'Freaks is where I come for AVR (and more recently SAM D20) talk. The last think I personally want is another site trying to make me social. Google's already moving in that direction with semi-forced Google+ migrations, which means I'm already looking to move away from them.
- Dean :twisted:
Can one choose between social and antisocial applications?
http://www.fastcolabs.com/301588...
I just unsubscribed from Linkedin endorsment notifications, got 2 emails about endorsment, one from my son in law and one from Larry Viesse, I'm sure these were OLD endorsments just being recycled by Linkedin just to get me to go to their site.
This drives me to drink!!
Can one choose between social and antisocial applications?
The Facebook-type "Like" voting controls do not seem to belong to this kind of fora as this one. That is because it is obvious the fact that 98,517 "likes" of an imbecile post ("liked" by an equal number of imbecile users) will never make that imbecile post in question any less imbecile; yet, it will be drawing the attention from other really useful messages with a lower "likes" count. In the same manner, a brilliant post with 7 "likes" only will be immensely ignored and will be lost in the sea of every other post with a "likes" count greater than that.
These "Like" buttons are meant to be used where they count for something, in places like popularity contests, for members screening, etc.; and this is the antipode of the true engineering fields. Except, of course, if dumbing the forum down by aiming at members quantity instead of quality is the marketing department's new goal.
Since we are here, let me quote a couple of recent messages regarding the so-called "social media" and their true function and purpose:
My strong objection on the use of the (euphemistically called) Social Networking Services is straightforward:It is not that smart for anyone to give away these amounts of their personal information to be accumulated and be kept for ever to one only foreign (and probably hostile) entity that is misusing people's trust.
Having scattered your personal views, data and information all over the web is very different than having handed the whole package over to a single information-gathering agency that will take the full control and ownership of your personal data, just like the FaceBook/Tweeter/Disqus/etc. are, and doing from the beginning of their existence. In reality, they are dangerous fool-traps, sugarcoated with a vague concept of friendship.
Facebook?
Do you mean that place which is full of "dumb fucks" according to its founder, Mark Zuckerberg?
Or that "CIA dream that came true" according to CIA deputy director Christopher Sartinsky?No, my fellow AVRFreaks. I have chosen not to be a member (or even a part) of such disgraceful social charades.
Most importantly, I hope to NEVER see a forum prompt in the lines of "Log in to Facebook by using your AVRFreaks account name and password" because such a partnership would certainly cost ATMEL a lot of their current AVRFreaks members who do not wish to be involved in such charades; a lot of current AVRFreaks members who have the brains and the knowledge required to keep this great technical forum not only afloat but amongst the crème de la crème of its kind; the very same members who made this forum a technical information goldmine.
-George
Where can I "Like" this post?Can't we get a forum where I can vote on these things! :wink:
Just because anybody can type in anything doesn't mean that it has the same value as what someone else contributes. And folks, especially novices, really have no way to curate the comments since the reason they are asking the question is that they don't know the answer. All you have to do is use stackexchange a few times to see how incredibly valuable this can be to getting good answers.
Yes, it does cripple the social aspect that some folks like hang out and comment on every thread whether they have anything to say or not, but I think that kicking that to the curb is a good thing. And maybe someone who is always batting less than 0 will get his feelings hurt and not contribute as much since folks are voting his posts down, but that too is a good thing. How else will folks learn to provide good technical help if they don't get feedback on the quality of their contributions?
I take as a given here that the majority of contributors know quality and [redacted] when they see it and will fairly vote their opinions.
So PLEASE push a voting system to the folks designing the new AVRFreaks. IMHO that single addition will do more to improve the quality of answers and shunt aside the [redacted] than anything I can think of.
Smiley
So PLEASE push a voting system to the folks designing the new AVRFreaks. IMHO that single addition will do more to improve the quality of answers and shunt aside the [redacted] than anything I can think of.
Just so you know, in the meetings we had last week, this was definitely one feature that was brought up that everyone agreed on for the exact reasons you mention.
It does help a community separate the wheat from the chaff and I think it will go a long way to improve the general "atmosphere" here.
So, yes, it's a very much desired feature on our end too. I'll see that it happens.
Eric.
1. If you ask the question you have to be prepared for negative opinions re the matter.
2. I speculate that most resident 'freaks are largely content with the general functionality of 'freaks, but want i) the quirks ironed out, and ii) other added functionality than social media integration. (I have described my personal wishes in another post.)
3. Without checking, I estimate that the average age of the posters in this thread is >40 rather than <20. This says something about what answers you would expect from the residents.
4. If you want to attract new people to AVRfreaks then don't ask the people already here.
5. The numerical poll result speaks clearky about the opinion of 'freaks members that care about the issue (the "definitively" votes are 3 percent, the nays and don't cares are 97 percent of the casted votes). Everything else is debate, and your pig/engineer/mud allegory (which I love!) holds.
Everything else is debate,
To be honest, my personal old fart characteristics are such highly developed that i simply have no idea how a connection of AVRfreaks with those social blabla things might work.
I would have no problem with some elegantly placed facebook "like" buttons that don't get into my way of following a technical discussion, but if such connections would lead to a situation where part of the information flow would only be accessible when one actually follows/uses those social media connections, then i would indeed have a problem.
4. If you want to attract new people to AVRfreaks then don't ask the people already here.
I also think folks are over worrying about this. If I'm understanding Atmel's intent,then we are talking about a few unobtrusive buttons placed on the site. We already have a bunch of buttons that I never use. Look at the top of a thread and you'll see 'member list' 'user group' and 'rss' - I've never used any of those. Look at the base of any post and you'll see 'profile' 'pm' 'www' and 'quote' - I've used 'pm' and 'quote'. Also notice the very bottom of the thread there are another group of buttons, most I've never used. I never even realized we had a print button until I was looking at the long pill at the bottom.
What I'm saying is that we already have a bunch of buttons that most of us probably never use. A bar of social media buttons can equally be ignored by those of us who have no interest. They won't hurt us and they might help the folks teethed on the Internet.
At some point the folks at Atmel should probably expound on the concept 'social media' so we'll know what they are really talking about. I'm hearing stuff here like 'if they start following me around I'm jumping out a window!'
The following around stuff is inherent in many common Internet facilities like Google, and used to place ads on places that want those sorts of ads like Hotmail. But I can't see any reason for AVRFreaks to have them. Why would a company allow ads from other companies on one of its websites?
Also, there won't be any 'following around' because Atmel has no way of knowing where you've been like Google or Bing do. They might pay Google or Bing to place microcontroller ads on sites visited by folks who have previously searched for microcontroller terms - but that has nothing to do with AVRFreaks.
AVRFreaks isn't some site trying to make money off the eyes of visitors by selling them to advertisers. Hackaday and similar web sites with no corporate sponsorship must make money to keep the lights on so they do sell advertising that is likely based on social media behavior, but think it through - what could Atmel possible get by selling the information it gets from us posting on AVRFreaks?
So bottom line IMHO, the problem here among the coffee club is fear of the unknown - we really don't understand social media very well and what we do know, we hate. However, I'll bet that we all are exposed to social media features on other websites and never even notice them and those are the sorts of features AVRFreaks planners are studying: innocuous button links that don't have to be used.
So Atmel should ASAP explain what social media means to the planners lurking in the dark shadows that surround AVRFreaks so we can stop jumping every time a rabbit farts.
Smiley
I don't know exactly what it will look like. However, we did talk about having exactly what you said: a drop down list of various social media buttons, placed out of the way, and easily ignored.
Look, we don't want this to be intrusive. We don't want to ruin your experience, only improve it. We're looking to do more than just bandage the existing platform, with spot fixes here and there. But, yes, we want to add new features too. Yes, it's absolutely imperative that nothing from here gets lost; we want to migrate all existing posts and threads to the new platform.
As to the poll: Cliff set up this poll. I started a different thread asking you guys what you want to see. Separately I started the other poll about what HW platform you want to use to connect to AVR Freaks.
. I started a different thread asking you guys what you want to see.
Check. I think we got that one covered. ;)
