Section 8 BOD is interesting. The app note suggests turning off BOD when the MCU is sleeping. It has a sampled mode which I used on the XMEGA series in sleep mode as it is pretty good on power consumption, but they recommend turning it off entirely.
I'm not convinced that the MCU will be able to wake up if you do that. I think it could latch up during sleep if there are power issues.
I've been reviewing the DA series as they seem to be still made whereas it looks like Microchip isn't in a rush to replenish the global stock of Megas.
Looking at the Errata document, I'm shocked how many mistakes there are on the silicon, some without any workarounds. Something that stands out to me is the flash endurance. The datasheet rates the flash endurance at 10,000 cycles, consistent with older Mega's and most microcontrollers. In the datasheet errata, page 14, it states that the flash write endurance is only 1000 cycles.I know it's unlikely that it will limit most users, as flash will only get erased/written a handful of time in production scenarios, but it does make me wonder what they did wrong with the silicon design that led to a huge de-rating. In the past I have taken advantage of the faster speed of flash vs. eeprom to store non-volatile data, but I'm not sure that would be possible with the DA series.
Posted by gchapman: Thu. Mar 24, 2022 - 03:10 AM(Reply to #314)
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trevorg wrote:
... whereas it looks like Microchip isn't in a rush to replenish the global stock of Megas.
The order backlog is impressive at distributors including microchipDIRECT but can't work the orders until there are lead frames.
Automotive manufacturers may have first cut which preloads the megaAVR wafer fabs (IIRC, Colorado Springs, Tempe Arizona, and Gresham Oregon); distributors are either secondary or tertiary.
Some megaAVR are wafer fab by SMIC and likely packaged relatively nearby so those may have greater availability.
trevorg wrote:
... but it does make me wonder what they did wrong with the silicon design that led to a huge de-rating.
AVR Dx is likely a new wafer fab process for the ones in the Microchip Technology 8-bit MCU design group (core voltage regulator, wide voltage, increased SOA, IDK where AVR Dx is wafer fab though first guess is TSMC)
Some AVR Dx characterization may have completed; characterization takes time due to sampling a significant number of wafers and batches and operating an environmental chamber(s)
I've been reviewing the DA series as they seem to be still made whereas it looks like Microchip isn't in a rush to replenish the global stock of Megas.
Looking at the Errata document, I'm shocked how many mistakes there are on the silicon, some without any workarounds. Something that stands out to me is the flash endurance. The datasheet rates the flash endurance at 10,000 cycles, consistent with older Mega's and most microcontrollers. In the datasheet errata, page 14, it states that the flash write endurance is only 1000 cycles.I know it's unlikely that it will limit most users, as flash will only get erased/written a handful of time in production scenarios, but it does make me wonder what they did wrong with the silicon design that led to a huge de-rating. In the past I have taken advantage of the faster speed of flash vs. eeprom to store non-volatile data, but I'm not sure that would be possible with the DA series.
My possibly flawed understanding is that the DB series are basically the DA with the bugs fixed, so if you are developing anything new try to use a DB. If it's old try to port to a DB.
They did the same thing with the XMEGA, the original A1 chips were pretty buggy and quickly replaced by the A1U parts.
You might be onto something Mojo, the DB series is remarkably similar. There are a few bugs still present in the errata, but the flash endurance is back to 10,000. I'm annoyed the Microchip haven't updated the datasheet for the DA series and put the discrepancy in the errata. It makes me think that they intentionally don't want to advertise the poor flash endurance in the datasheet. A few years ago I found an error in a datasheet for a ATTiny that caused me to swap the SDA and SCL lines on a board that I had made, they were happy to correct the datasheet for that so it's not hard to do.
#5 "If you think you need floating point to solve the problem then you don't understand the problem. If you really do need floating point then you have a problem you do not understand."
The recommended UPDI connection has changed since its first introduction. For this reason, both connections are described below, with the initial UPDI connection layout named UPDI Connection v1 while the new UPDI connection layout is named UPDI Connection v2. The difference between the two connections is the inclusion of a RESET signal in the connection for v2.
Microchip grows its commitment to the 8-bit PIC and AVR MCUs by releasing five new product families and over 60 new devices
Chandler, Arizona
April 28, 2022
[end of fourth paragraph]
For example, a WS2812 LED array, which requires unique timing to be driven correctly, can be controlled easily by configuring a super peripheral consisting of a Pulse-Width Modulator (PWM), an SPI interface, and the Configurable Logic Cell (CLC).
[end of sixth paragraph]
“We have also built a robust supply chain for 8-bit PIC and AVR MCUs, the vast majority of which are manufactured in Microchip-owned facilities. This allows us to control the production process in ways that are not common in the industry.” [Greg Robinson, vice president of marketing for Microchip’s 8-bit MCU business unit]
Development Tools
[Melody]
Availability
All five product families are currently sampling or in production. For more information click here. To purchase, contact a Microchip sales representative, authorized worldwide distributor or Microchip’s Purchasing and Client Services website, www.microchipDIRECT.com.
Another graph in Jacob's article shows lowly 8-bit MCUs still hugely successful, despite so many analysts having condemned them to the scrap heap for so long. Cheap processing has driven this industry since its earliest days; 8 bits are cheap; and I expect that force will continue to open new and unexpected markets for computing of all sorts.
Posted by Brian Fairchild: Sat. Jun 11, 2022 - 01:22 PM
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GermanFranz wrote:
The raison d'être of the new DD devices hasn't really opened up to me yet...
My take...
the AVR range has felt to me to be a bit fragmented. You'd have, at most, maybe 3 similar devices in a group, with varying memory sizes. Compare this to PICs where you'd have the same basic device available in 4 or 5 package sizes with 4 or 5 memory sizes.
This has changed with the Dx series.
We already have the DA, and DB series in almost full production. The DD is starting to come online, we can assume that there will be a DC range, and for smaller devices (tiny?) we have the EA range. Need more flash? Just move up a memory size. More pins? Pick a bigger package. The same underlying features will still be there.
#5 "If you think you need floating point to solve the problem then you don't understand the problem. If you really do need floating point then you have a problem you do not understand."
Hard/Software solutions that already exist in abundance.
It would have been interesting to be able to use this network capability simply in assembler. The knowledge required for this is still much more extensive than it could be- - and probably also the implementation.
The AVR-IoT Cellular Mini Development Board is the latest to join Microchip’s AVR® family, providing developers an easy blueprint for building IoT devices
Chandler, Arizona, June 21, 2022
[end of first paragraph]
... Microchip Technology Inc. (Nasdaq: MCHP) today announces the AVR-IoT Cellular Mini Development Board based on the AVR128DB48 8-bit microcontroller (MCU). This solution provides a robust platform to start building sensor and actuator nodes on 5G narrowband IoT networks.
[end of third paragraph]
The ATECC608 device can easily be configured to most major cloud service providers through Microchip’s IoT Provisioning Tool.
[end of sixth paragraph]
Microchip partnered with Sequans to include its Monarch 2 GM02S single-chip radio equipped with 5G LTE-M and narrowband IoT. Microchip also partnered with Truphone to provide the SIM card for cellular service that offers reliable coverage worldwide.
[end of ninth paragraph]
It is also Arduino®-compatible and is supported by Microchip’s Github Library which provides functionality for HTTPS, MQ Telemetry Transport (MQTT), low power and more.
Section 8 BOD is interesting. The app note suggests turning off BOD when the MCU is sleeping. It has a sampled mode which I used on the XMEGA series in sleep mode as it is pretty good on power consumption, but they recommend turning it off entirely.
I'm not convinced that the MCU will be able to wake up if you do that. I think it could latch up during sleep if there are power issues.
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Tophttps://packs.download.microchip.com/#collapse-Microchip-AVR-Ex-DFP-pdsc
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Topon sale this month
Part Number: EV35L43A - AVR128DB48 Curiosity Nano Evaluation kit | Welcome to Microchip Technology | Microchip Technology Inc.
due to
Dev Tool Deals | Microchip Technology
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TopThanks
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TopAVR® EA Product Family Advanced Analog Sensing Made Simple
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TopMVIO and OPAMP :
Analog Applications in 8-bit PIC® and AVR® Microcontrollers
edit :
TB3309 Analog Applications in 8-bit PIC® and AVR® Microcontrollers | Application Note | Microchip Technology (PDF)
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Topre AVR DB OPAMP
Gain Bandwidth Product (GBWP) | Maximizing the Signal: How to Use and Understand Embedded Operational Amplifiers
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TopGitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-cnano-out-of-the-box-code-mplab-mcc: ...
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TopI have to say, I really like having the examples documentation and code published on github...
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TopI like the ASCII art on the project
********************************************************************************************************
* MMMMMMMMMNddhysyyyysyyhdmMMNNNMMMMM *
* MMMMMMmhssssssssssssssssshMNmmMMMMM *
* MMMMdyssssssssssssssssssssyNMMMMMMM *
* MMmyssssso-`.ossssssso-.-osymMMMMMM *
* Mdssssss/` `/sssss: `+ssdMMMMM __ __ _ _ _ *
* mssssss/ -sss- /ssyNMMM | \/ (_) | | (_) *
* yssssoso- .oso. -ssymMM | \ / |_ ___ _ __ ___ ___| |__ _ _ __ *
* ysso- -ss/` `/ss- .ossdM | |\/| | |/ __| '__/ _ \ / __| '_ \| | '_ \ *
* ys+` .os+` :ss/` `/ssh | | | | | (__| | | (_) | (__| | | | | |_) | *
* y: `+so- .os+` :sh |_| |_|_|\___|_| \___/ \___|_| |_|_| .__/ *
* m` -osss/ -sso- /M | | *
* Mh` `/ssssss+` :sssss/ -NM |_| *
* MMm: -osssssssso-`.+sssssss+` +NMM *
* MMMMhysssssssssssssssssssssso+mMMMM *
* MMMMMMNdysssssssssssssssssydNMMMMMM *
* MMMMMMMMMNmdhyyysssyyhhdmMMMMMMMMMM *
********************************************************************************************************
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Top"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller
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Topdatasheet clarifications
AVR128DA Silicon Errata and Data Sheet Clarification
AVR128DA Silicon Errata and Data Sheet Clarification (web doc)
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TopI've been reviewing the DA series as they seem to be still made whereas it looks like Microchip isn't in a rush to replenish the global stock of Megas.
Looking at the Errata document, I'm shocked how many mistakes there are on the silicon, some without any workarounds. Something that stands out to me is the flash endurance. The datasheet rates the flash endurance at 10,000 cycles, consistent with older Mega's and most microcontrollers. In the datasheet errata, page 14, it states that the flash write endurance is only 1000 cycles.I know it's unlikely that it will limit most users, as flash will only get erased/written a handful of time in production scenarios, but it does make me wonder what they did wrong with the silicon design that led to a huge de-rating. In the past I have taken advantage of the faster speed of flash vs. eeprom to store non-volatile data, but I'm not sure that would be possible with the DA series.
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TopAutomotive manufacturers may have first cut which preloads the megaAVR wafer fabs (IIRC, Colorado Springs, Tempe Arizona, and Gresham Oregon); distributors are either secondary or tertiary.
Some megaAVR are wafer fab by SMIC and likely packaged relatively nearby so those may have greater availability.
Some AVR Dx characterization may have completed; characterization takes time due to sampling a significant number of wafers and batches and operating an environmental chamber(s)
Lead Time | World's Largest Inventory of Microchip Products
ATMEL parts are running out of stock due to wafer shortage ? | AVR Freaks
How to search for Microchip PCNs (SMIC, '12 and earlier)
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TopMy possibly flawed understanding is that the DB series are basically the DA with the bugs fixed, so if you are developing anything new try to use a DB. If it's old try to port to a DB.
They did the same thing with the XMEGA, the original A1 chips were pretty buggy and quickly replaced by the A1U parts.
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TopYou might be onto something Mojo, the DB series is remarkably similar. There are a few bugs still present in the errata, but the flash endurance is back to 10,000. I'm annoyed the Microchip haven't updated the datasheet for the DA series and put the discrepancy in the errata. It makes me think that they intentionally don't want to advertise the poor flash endurance in the datasheet. A few years ago I found an error in a datasheet for a ATTiny that caused me to swap the SDA and SCL lines on a board that I had made, they were happy to correct the datasheet for that so it's not hard to do.
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TopAVR DB errata
web docupdated today.AVR128DB28/32/48/64 Silicon Errata and Data Sheet Clarifications
AVR64DB28/32/48/64 Silicon Errata and Data Sheet Clarifications
AVR32DB28/32/48 Silicon Errata and Data Sheet Clarifications
edit2 : web doc
AVR128DB : Silicon Errata and Data Sheet Clarifications
AVR64DB : Silicon Errata and Data Sheet Clarifications
AVR32DB : Silicon Errata and Data Sheet Clarifications
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TopYou've got to be kidding me!
I literally just designed the symbol in Altium.
Why aren't they updating the datasheet!!??
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TopWhich bits of the errata affect the pin-out? And what of the errors is going to cause you issues?
#1 Hardware Problem? https://www.avrfreaks.net/forum/...
#2 Hardware Problem? Read AVR042.
#3 All grounds are not created equal
#4 Have you proved your chip is running at xxMHz?
#5 "If you think you need floating point to solve the problem then you don't understand the problem. If you really do need floating point then you have a problem you do not understand."
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TopGitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-ac-mplabx: This repository contains 3 bare-metal code examples that show how to use the AC peripheral of the AVR64DD32 device in different modes.
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-adc-mplabx: Code examples for using the ADC peripheral.
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-bod-mplabx: Code examples for the BOD peripheral.
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-ccl-mplabx: This repository contains 3 bare-metal code examples that show how to use the CCL peripheral of the AVR64DD32 device in different modes.
<placeholder for CPU>GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-cpu-mplabx: This project demonstrates the interrupt handling features of the AVR® CPU.
edit :
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-dac-mplabx: Code example for the DAC peripheral.
edit2 :
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-rtc-mplabx: Code examples for the RTC peripheral.
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-tca-mplabx: Code examples for using Timer/Counter Type A (TCA)
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-tcb-mplabx: Code examples for the TCB peripheral.
edit3 :
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-mvio-mplabx: Code examples for using the MVIO pins.
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-tcd-mplabx: Code example for the TCD peripheral
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-wdt-mplabx: Code example for the Watch Dog Timer peripheral.
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-zcd-mplabx: Code examples for the ZCD peripheral.
edit4 : TWI
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-i2c-mplabx: Code examples for the I2C peripheral,
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-i2c-mplabx-mcc: Getting Started with Inter-Integrated Circuit (I2C) Using the AVR64DD32 Microcontroller with MCC Melody
edit5 :
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-gpio-mplabx: Guide for using the GPIO of the AVR64DD32 Microcontroller
edit6 :
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-spi-mplabx: Guide for using SPI for the AVR64DD32 Microcontroller
edit7 :
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-ac-mplabx-mcc: Getting started with AC and MCC for AVR64DD32
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-spi-mplabx-mcc: Getting Started with SPI on AVR64DD32 using MCC Melody
edit8 :
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-adc-mplabx-mcc: Getting Started with ADC on AVR64DD32 using MCC Melody
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-bod-mplabx-mcc: Getting Started with BOD on AVR64DD32 using MCC Melody
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-ccl-mplabx-mcc: Getting Started with CCL on AVR64DD32 using MCC Melody
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-cpu-mplabx-mcc: Getting Started with CPU on AVR64DD32 using MCC Melody
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-usart-mplabx: Guide for using USART on the AVR64DD32 Microcontroller
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-usart-mplabx-mcc: Getting Started with USART on AVR64DD32 using MCC Melody
edit9 :
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-examples/avr64dd32-getting-started-with-tca-mplabx-mcc: Guide for using TCA for the AVR64DD32 microcontroller.
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TopUPDI connection v2 for MPLAB PICkit 4.
edit :
AVR64DD28/328 Preliminary Data Sheet (PDF)
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TopSame wrong SPI-IF "is cleared by hardware when executing the corresponding interrupt vector"
description like in all other Series 0/1/2 controller data sheets
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TopAVR DD released.
Come Join Us (MPLAB Now Supports AVRs) | Page 8 | AVR Freaks (Melody)
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TopAVR-IoT Celluar Mini
AVR-LTE-Cellular-Mini
Monarch 2 GM02S Module (Global) - Sequans Communications
edit :
AVR-IoT Cellular Mini Hardware User Guide (web doc)
AVR-IoT Cellular Mini Hardware User Guide (PDF)
edit2 :
GitHub - microchip-pic-avr-solutions/avr-iot-cellular-arduino-library: Arduino library for developing Cellular IoT Applications with the AVR-IoT Cellular Mini development board from Microchip
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TopProcessing Analog Sensor Data with Digital Filtering
GitHub URL currently generates a 404.
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TopIs this more vaporware like the AVR-EA series?
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TopNo answer
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TopAVR64DD28/32 Silicon Errata and Data Sheet Clarification (web doc)
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TopLacking are the 32 KB instances.
https://www.microchipdirect.com/product/search/all/avr64dd
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TopAVR32DD20
AVR32DD14
AVR16DD20
AVR16DD14
AVR® DD Family (web doc)
AVR16/32DD14/20 Silicon Errata and Data Sheet Clarification (web doc)
AVR32/16DD20/14 Preliminary Data Sheet (PDF)
edit :
AVR16/32DD14/20 Silicon Errata and Data Sheet Clarification (PDF)
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TopI'll just copy the signature bytes for the DD series here for reference, so I can find them easily in the future.
Since some AVR-DD are finally in production, it's time to update jtag2updi to support these chips.
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TopIs there a Microchip news ticker somewhere for new data sheet releases? Or are they accidental finds?
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TopRSS
https://www.microchip.com/RSS/Recent-DataSheets.xml
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TopThanks. Good service
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Topinitial release
AVR64DD32 CNANO Hardware User Guide (web doc)
edit :
ETA IDK
AVR64DD32 Curiosity Nano | Microchip Technology
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Top"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller
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TopAbove all, 8 bits are:
Much simpler and at the same time sufficient for so many things. Why should this change in the next 100 years?
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Top8-bit MCU may fill a current 4-bit MCU niche (watches are first to mind)
Exchange - RISC-V International
Memory safe computer languages | AVR Freaks
Electronic Systems | Brands & Companies - Swatch Group (EM Microelectronic)
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Top64 KB AVR DD, some in stock, as low as 1.3USD each for 100, remainder arriving early July'22
AVR DD MCUs - Microchip Technology | Mouser
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TopWell, I don't see any major competition in RISC-V and its devices. Hardly more menacing than ARM.
So I would say rather fundamentally simpler programming. So simple that the hardware no longer plays a role in the thinking effort.
The raison d'être of the new DD devices hasn't really opened up to me yet...
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TopAVR® DD | Microchip Technology
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TopMy take...
the AVR range has felt to me to be a bit fragmented. You'd have, at most, maybe 3 similar devices in a group, with varying memory sizes. Compare this to PICs where you'd have the same basic device available in 4 or 5 package sizes with 4 or 5 memory sizes.
This has changed with the Dx series.
We already have the DA, and DB series in almost full production. The DD is starting to come online, we can assume that there will be a DC range, and for smaller devices (tiny?) we have the EA range. Need more flash? Just move up a memory size. More pins? Pick a bigger package. The same underlying features will still be there.
#1 Hardware Problem? https://www.avrfreaks.net/forum/...
#2 Hardware Problem? Read AVR042.
#3 All grounds are not created equal
#4 Have you proved your chip is running at xxMHz?
#5 "If you think you need floating point to solve the problem then you don't understand the problem. If you really do need floating point then you have a problem you do not understand."
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TopAVR-da/db seems aimed at the ATmega space (28 pins is the low end.) AVR-dd seems aimed at ATtiny (32 pins is the high end.)
(and OMG the overlapping package sizes seem to have compatible pin-outs! What is the world coming to?)
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Topstocked
AVR-IoT Cellular Mini | Microchip Technology
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TopHard/Software solutions that already exist in abundance.
It would have been interesting to be able to use this network capability simply in assembler. The knowledge required for this is still much more extensive than it could be- - and probably also the implementation.
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Tophttps://github.com/microchip-pic-avr-tools/iotprovision/blob/main/iotprovision/cellular/cellularprovisioner.py#L58
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TopCorrection of two minor defects.
Revision 6 | AVR-IoT Cellular Mini Hardware User Guide
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Toppress release
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TopThank you for the nice example gchapman, maybe someone will find it useful.
I only program in assembler- because the 8Bit AVRs make it relatively easy too.
I can therefore do very little with high-level language examples including obscurely imported functionalities.
Conversely, if I were to program in high-level language, there would be no reason to limit myself to AVRs.
Then it would be better to use a powerful 32Bit controller right away.
Let's start with practical use: Data is to be exchanged between two distant wireless circuit boards.
All I want its important to know is: Where is the data to be copied to, where to get the data,
what is the security key if necessary, and how are the cellular modules to be configured?
It could be so damn easy.
As it is such modules are useless for me and I prefer to use other wireless options plus existing,
permanently installed internet connection, even if that may be more cumbersome overall.
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TopCoffee Break | S7E2 | Cellular IoT - YouTube (20m10s)
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