Thermal Vias

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I am trying to do a DIY pcb by milling. I need to solder wire in these vias so I would like to have them thermally isolated. Anyone knows if there is an option for that in Eagle that I am missing? I need the bottom via(bottom of the picture) to be "sectioned out" of the VIC plane so that it will be easier to solder a wire through it (just like the pad at the top of the picture).

 

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TO THE FINDER... THE ISLE OF KOHOLINT, IS BUT AN ILLUSION... HUMAN, MONSTER, SEA, SKY... A SCENE ON THE LID OF A SLEEPER'S EYE... AWAKE THE DREAMER, AND KOHOLINT WILL VANISH MUCH LIKE A BUBBLE ON A NEEDLE... CAST-AWAY, YOU SHOULD KNOW THE TRUTH!

Last Edited: Tue. Feb 2, 2021 - 10:41 PM
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tellSlater wrote:
I need to solder wire in these vias ...
fyi, rivets at 0.12USD each.

EasyContac | LPKF Online Store

 

"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller

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What you request doesn't make sense.

 

On the top, the via is contained in a surrounding plane, hence the thermal relief.

On the bottom the via just connects to a trace, so there would be never be a thermal connection (your screen shot shows no plane surrounding the via bottom).

 

If you draw a polygon around the via bottom ( and give it the same net name), then it  should generate the thermal relief (if that polygon is configured to do so).  your trace must only go to the polygon, NOT the via

 

also 

the bottom via

what does that mean? A via is both top and bottom!   You prop meant via bottom  or bottom of the via?

When in the dark remember-the future looks brighter than ever.   I look forward to being able to predict the future!

Last Edited: Tue. Feb 2, 2021 - 04:47 PM
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I have really confused you with this post I see. I meant the via that is visible at the bottom of the picture I posted.

I do not have the rivets that were suggested above and was planning to just solder some thin wire in place (to connect the top and bottom layers). It would help if the via's bottom pad (blue side) was thermally insulated from the rest of the VIC copper (blue sruff around it) in order to help me solder the wire more easily. I need to make a cross pattern just like the pad on the top of the image I posted has. Or I will consider buying some rivets. Although I would need some equipment to get said rivets in place properly I suppose - so I'd rather just solder some wire in.

TO THE FINDER... THE ISLE OF KOHOLINT, IS BUT AN ILLUSION... HUMAN, MONSTER, SEA, SKY... A SCENE ON THE LID OF A SLEEPER'S EYE... AWAKE THE DREAMER, AND KOHOLINT WILL VANISH MUCH LIKE A BUBBLE ON A NEEDLE... CAST-AWAY, YOU SHOULD KNOW THE TRUTH!

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I cannot use this store but I had found some locally. I did not buy them because I don't know what tool to use / how to install them. To you know a DIY way to do that or some tool name I should search?

TO THE FINDER... THE ISLE OF KOHOLINT, IS BUT AN ILLUSION... HUMAN, MONSTER, SEA, SKY... A SCENE ON THE LID OF A SLEEPER'S EYE... AWAKE THE DREAMER, AND KOHOLINT WILL VANISH MUCH LIKE A BUBBLE ON A NEEDLE... CAST-AWAY, YOU SHOULD KNOW THE TRUTH!

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I had this

then i added a rectangle in the trestrict layer 41...no more thermal connection

 

 

When in the dark remember-the future looks brighter than ever.   I look forward to being able to predict the future!

Last Edited: Tue. Feb 2, 2021 - 07:01 PM
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hmmm seems a bit strange to use. I would expect something more automated to exist. It will do for now though, thank you!

TO THE FINDER... THE ISLE OF KOHOLINT, IS BUT AN ILLUSION... HUMAN, MONSTER, SEA, SKY... A SCENE ON THE LID OF A SLEEPER'S EYE... AWAKE THE DREAMER, AND KOHOLINT WILL VANISH MUCH LIKE A BUBBLE ON A NEEDLE... CAST-AWAY, YOU SHOULD KNOW THE TRUTH!

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tellSlater wrote:
To you know a DIY way to do that or some tool name I should search?
try second-hand rivet tools as passed down, or sold, by sheet metal technicians (aluminum sheet is essential for aircraft, late model pickup truck bodies are from aluminum sheet so automobile body repair, the thickness of some aluminum sheet approximates typical FR-4)

An alternative :

Plated-Thru Holes | PCB "Fab-In-A-Box" ... The 8min circuit board system

...

3. Soldered Wire - amateur look, not pretty & time consuming

...

Hey! ... in the field, when you damage a via you repair from what's in your toolbox.

 

"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller

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tellSlater wrote:

hmmm seems a bit strange to use. I would expect something more automated to exist. It will do for now though, thank you!

Maybe you should just use a regular through-hole pad instead of via? They have thermal relief to surrounding connected polygons so are probably better fitted for this purpose.

/Jakob Selbing

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This is exactly what I wanted to achieve:

 

 

If anyone knows a more direct-easy way of doing it please let me know. Thanks for helping all!

TO THE FINDER... THE ISLE OF KOHOLINT, IS BUT AN ILLUSION... HUMAN, MONSTER, SEA, SKY... A SCENE ON THE LID OF A SLEEPER'S EYE... AWAKE THE DREAMER, AND KOHOLINT WILL VANISH MUCH LIKE A BUBBLE ON A NEEDLE... CAST-AWAY, YOU SHOULD KNOW THE TRUTH!

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Note that by default, vias do not use thermals to connect to planes---they are 100% connected, unless you turn on an option in the setup to connect vias to polygons using thermals.  Pads (such as for through hole parts) DO  (or more accurately, can) use thermals to a plane.

 

So instead of using a via, you could place a pad there and get the thin thermal connection to the plane.

Here you  see the red trace connects to a via touching the entire surrounding plane on the blue layer

 

Now a pad with the same name as the blue plane is slid on top of the via (note the pad is a component)

Notice the thermal reliefs are formed were the via still resides

 

 

Note that the pad (a defined library building block!!) has the option to use/not use thermal.

....not sure what would happen if you turn off thermal for that part...would the thermal simply go away or would no thermal cause the full connection to resume (likely)?  I didn't try

 

 

 

 

When in the dark remember-the future looks brighter than ever.   I look forward to being able to predict the future!

Last Edited: Tue. Feb 2, 2021 - 10:01 PM
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I had thought of that before but I neglected it because I thought the pad must be present in the schematic as well. Every time I try to bring in a pad in the board editor I get the message "Please do this in the schematic". It's a bit clunky when you start working on the board after finishing the schematic and don't really know how many VIAS you are going to need. On top of that VIAS should not be present in the schematic - it seems wrong to me anyways. Is there a way to insert a pad in the board editor without it being present in the schematic?

TO THE FINDER... THE ISLE OF KOHOLINT, IS BUT AN ILLUSION... HUMAN, MONSTER, SEA, SKY... A SCENE ON THE LID OF A SLEEPER'S EYE... AWAKE THE DREAMER, AND KOHOLINT WILL VANISH MUCH LIKE A BUBBLE ON A NEEDLE... CAST-AWAY, YOU SHOULD KNOW THE TRUTH!

Last Edited: Tue. Feb 2, 2021 - 09:25 PM
This reply has been marked as the solution. 
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s there a way to insert a pad in the board editor without it being present in the schematic?

I don't think so---the pad is part of a component (such as an inductor, or  transistor).   I have pads defined for soldering wires to board & these appear in the schematic as such

 

Note in my example to you, I dragged a pad that already existed on that plane over the via (via remained)...doing so caused the thermals to be generated...if the pad didn't exist I'd have to add it in the schematic...or use the restrict layer as noted

 

 

I'll take something back...there is a via option (I've never used)...maybe you should try, under PCB design rules

The Generate thermals for vias flag permits Thermal symbols at through­hole contacts. Otherwise vias are fully connected to the copper plane. This applies also for polygons. But you can disable this option for individual polygons with CHANGE THERMALS OFF and a mouse click onto the polygon's contour...(but not for individual arbitrary vias, it seems).

 

Does this sound interesting:

You can get what you expect. There is a setting in the DRC settings that

will give you thermals at vias.

 

DRC > Supply > Generate thermals for vias

 

Normally, for commercially made boards, you would not need thermals for

vias as there is no soldering at a via. For home made boards where you

are soldering a wire through the board of the non plated holes they

could be useful.

 

When in the dark remember-the future looks brighter than ever.   I look forward to being able to predict the future!

Last Edited: Tue. Feb 2, 2021 - 10:32 PM
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Now we re talking! This is the neat way I was looking for. Thanks!

TO THE FINDER... THE ISLE OF KOHOLINT, IS BUT AN ILLUSION... HUMAN, MONSTER, SEA, SKY... A SCENE ON THE LID OF A SLEEPER'S EYE... AWAKE THE DREAMER, AND KOHOLINT WILL VANISH MUCH LIKE A BUBBLE ON A NEEDLE... CAST-AWAY, YOU SHOULD KNOW THE TRUTH!