SPLIT: Defining an Instant

Log in or register to post comments
Go To Last Post
25 posts / 0 new
Author
Message
the_real_seebs
the_real_seebs's picture
Level: Hangaround
Joined: Sun. Dec 3, 2017
Posts: 198 View posts
#1
Posted by the_real_seebs: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 06:45 AM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

awneil wrote:

Increase wrote:
I didn't realize I can destroy the sensor in an instant

(almost?) any electronic component will be destroyed "in an instant" by gross abuse like connecting its power supply backwards!

 

Is a resistor a component? :P

 

EDIT:

Split from: https://www.avrfreaks.net/forum/r...

 

 

Tags:

AVR Microcontrollers, megaAVR and tinyAVR
Last Edited: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 04:33 PM
Top
awneil
awneil's picture
Level: 10k+ Postman
Joined: Fri. Jul 1, 2005
Posts: 16664 View posts
Location: Basingstoke, Hampshire, UK
Posted by awneil: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 12:08 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

the_real_seebs wrote:
Is a resistor a component? :P

Ha ha - yes, of course!

 

Although resistors are not sensitive to polarity (ie, have no sense of "backwards"), they will still be damaged - if not destroyed - by "gross abuse".

Probably not "in an instant" - but still probably wise to discard one that has been "insanely hot"...

 

It's semiconductor components that are most likely to be destroyed "in an instant".

 

I thought I'd said that before in this thread, but it was actually the OP's other thread: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...

 

Top Tips:

  1. How to properly post source code - see: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment... - also how to properly include images/pictures
  2. "Garbage" characters on a serial terminal are (almost?) invariably due to wrong baud rate - see: https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/serial-communication
  3. Wrong baud rate is usually due to not running at the speed you thought; check by blinking a LED to see if you get the speed you expected
  4. Difference between a crystal, and a crystal oscillator: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  5. When your question is resolved, mark the solution: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  6. Beginner's "Getting Started" tips: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
Top
theusch
theusch's picture
Level: 10k+ Postman
Joined: Mon. Feb 19, 2001
Posts: 39569 View posts
Location: Wisconsin USA
Posted by theusch: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 02:54 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

the_real_seebs wrote:
Is a resistor a component? :P

awneil wrote:
Probably not "in an instant"

Define "instant".  A fuse blows quite quickly.  You tell me whether the time satisfies your definition of "instant".

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=... [note that there is beer involved]

DC lamps ("light bulbs") aren't that common in the LED age.  But IIRC, the filament would blow "instantly" given too many watts.

 

 

You can put lipstick on a pig, but it is still a pig.

I've never met a pig I didn't like, as long as you have some salt and pepper.

Top
awneil
awneil's picture
Level: 10k+ Postman
Joined: Fri. Jul 1, 2005
Posts: 16664 View posts
Location: Basingstoke, Hampshire, UK
Posted by awneil: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 03:41 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

I am just quoting the the OP's words of #26:

Increase wrote:
I didn't realize I can destroy the sensor in an instant.

 

So, basically, "sooner than you can realise that something's going wrong, and turn the power off".

 

Yes, you could probably destroy an average 1k, 1/8W resistor "in an instant" by connecting it directly to 240V mains - but, please, don't try this at home!

 

surprise

 

You'll be wanting me to define "gross" (sic) abuse next ...

 

cheeky

Top Tips:

  1. How to properly post source code - see: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment... - also how to properly include images/pictures
  2. "Garbage" characters on a serial terminal are (almost?) invariably due to wrong baud rate - see: https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/serial-communication
  3. Wrong baud rate is usually due to not running at the speed you thought; check by blinking a LED to see if you get the speed you expected
  4. Difference between a crystal, and a crystal oscillator: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  5. When your question is resolved, mark the solution: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  6. Beginner's "Getting Started" tips: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
Top
awneil
awneil's picture
Level: 10k+ Postman
Joined: Fri. Jul 1, 2005
Posts: 16664 View posts
Location: Basingstoke, Hampshire, UK
Posted by awneil: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 03:45 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

theusch wrote:
A fuse blows quite quickly.  You tell me whether the time satisfies your definition of "instant"

Generally, fuses are useless for protecting semiconductors - because the semiconductor will blow first.

 

So, yes - I guess that would qualify as "instant"

 

 

 

Top Tips:

  1. How to properly post source code - see: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment... - also how to properly include images/pictures
  2. "Garbage" characters on a serial terminal are (almost?) invariably due to wrong baud rate - see: https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/serial-communication
  3. Wrong baud rate is usually due to not running at the speed you thought; check by blinking a LED to see if you get the speed you expected
  4. Difference between a crystal, and a crystal oscillator: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  5. When your question is resolved, mark the solution: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  6. Beginner's "Getting Started" tips: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
Top
theusch
theusch's picture
Level: 10k+ Postman
Joined: Mon. Feb 19, 2001
Posts: 39569 View posts
Location: Wisconsin USA
Posted by theusch: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 03:54 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

awneil wrote:
Generally, fuses are useless for protecting semiconductors - because the semiconductor will blow first.

Did you read the quotes I was responding to?  It had to do with "is a resistor a component".  I gave two examples (or maybe one, as both are generally filaments) that I think would qualify for components.  Indeed, you define "instant" and "gross".

You can put lipstick on a pig, but it is still a pig.

I've never met a pig I didn't like, as long as you have some salt and pepper.

Top
jgmdesign
jgmdesign's picture
Level: Moderator
Joined: Mon. Mar 19, 2007
Posts: 16250 View posts
Location: Long Island New York
Posted by jgmdesign: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 04:29 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Maybe the thread should be split as its now a squabble about what an "Instant" is as opposed to the topic of the thread.

 

JIm

I would rather attempt something great and fail, than attempt nothing and succeed - Fortune Cookie

 

"The critical shortage here is not stuff, but time." - Johan Ekdahl

 

"Step N is required before you can do step N+1!" - ka7ehk

 

"If you want a career with a known path - become an undertaker. Dead people don't sue!" - Kartman

"Why is there a "Highway to Hell" and only a "Stairway to Heaven"? A prediction of the expected traffic load?"  - Lee "theusch"

 

Speak sweetly. It makes your words easier to digest when at a later date you have to eat them ;-)  - Source Unknown

Please Read: Code-of-Conduct

Atmel Studio6.2/AS7, DipTrace, Quartus, MPLAB, RSLogix user

Top
awneil
awneil's picture
Level: 10k+ Postman
Joined: Fri. Jul 1, 2005
Posts: 16664 View posts
Location: Basingstoke, Hampshire, UK
Posted by awneil: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 04:38 PM (Reply to #7)
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

or what a "component" is ?

 

cheeky

Top Tips:

  1. How to properly post source code - see: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment... - also how to properly include images/pictures
  2. "Garbage" characters on a serial terminal are (almost?) invariably due to wrong baud rate - see: https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/serial-communication
  3. Wrong baud rate is usually due to not running at the speed you thought; check by blinking a LED to see if you get the speed you expected
  4. Difference between a crystal, and a crystal oscillator: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  5. When your question is resolved, mark the solution: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  6. Beginner's "Getting Started" tips: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
Top
jgmdesign
jgmdesign's picture
Level: Moderator
Joined: Mon. Mar 19, 2007
Posts: 16250 View posts
Location: Long Island New York
Posted by jgmdesign: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 04:49 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

awneil wrote:

or what a "component" is ?

 

cheeky

Oh for **** sake knock it off......angrylaugh

 

Jim

I would rather attempt something great and fail, than attempt nothing and succeed - Fortune Cookie

 

"The critical shortage here is not stuff, but time." - Johan Ekdahl

 

"Step N is required before you can do step N+1!" - ka7ehk

 

"If you want a career with a known path - become an undertaker. Dead people don't sue!" - Kartman

"Why is there a "Highway to Hell" and only a "Stairway to Heaven"? A prediction of the expected traffic load?"  - Lee "theusch"

 

Speak sweetly. It makes your words easier to digest when at a later date you have to eat them ;-)  - Source Unknown

Please Read: Code-of-Conduct

Atmel Studio6.2/AS7, DipTrace, Quartus, MPLAB, RSLogix user

Top
Brian Fairchild
Brian Fairchild's picture
Level: Raving Lunatic
Joined: Thu. Oct 18, 2001
Posts: 4269 View posts
Location: Eastern England.
Posted by Brian Fairchild: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 05:04 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Back to the question posed in the topic title...

 

"Defining an Instant"

 

 

See 'Planck Time'

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pl...

#1 This forum helps those that help themselves

#2 All grounds are not created equal

#3 How have you proved that your chip is running at xxMHz?

#4 "If you think you need floating point to solve the problem then you don't understand the problem. If you really do need floating point then you have a problem you do not understand." - Heater's ex-boss

Top
awneil
awneil's picture
Level: 10k+ Postman
Joined: Fri. Jul 1, 2005
Posts: 16664 View posts
Location: Basingstoke, Hampshire, UK
Posted by awneil: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 05:19 PM (Reply to #10)
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Probably related to the definition of, "split second": https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...

 

Top Tips:

  1. How to properly post source code - see: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment... - also how to properly include images/pictures
  2. "Garbage" characters on a serial terminal are (almost?) invariably due to wrong baud rate - see: https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/serial-communication
  3. Wrong baud rate is usually due to not running at the speed you thought; check by blinking a LED to see if you get the speed you expected
  4. Difference between a crystal, and a crystal oscillator: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  5. When your question is resolved, mark the solution: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  6. Beginner's "Getting Started" tips: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
Top
jgmdesign
jgmdesign's picture
Level: Moderator
Joined: Mon. Mar 19, 2007
Posts: 16250 View posts
Location: Long Island New York
Posted by jgmdesign: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 05:32 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

 

 

INSTANT:Time required to go from fully functional to fully useless....

 

 

Before Andy and Lee post it:

 

awneil and theusch would probably write:

Define time

 

Define  required

 

Define fully

 

Define functional

 

Define useless

 

Jim

I would rather attempt something great and fail, than attempt nothing and succeed - Fortune Cookie

 

"The critical shortage here is not stuff, but time." - Johan Ekdahl

 

"Step N is required before you can do step N+1!" - ka7ehk

 

"If you want a career with a known path - become an undertaker. Dead people don't sue!" - Kartman

"Why is there a "Highway to Hell" and only a "Stairway to Heaven"? A prediction of the expected traffic load?"  - Lee "theusch"

 

Speak sweetly. It makes your words easier to digest when at a later date you have to eat them ;-)  - Source Unknown

Please Read: Code-of-Conduct

Atmel Studio6.2/AS7, DipTrace, Quartus, MPLAB, RSLogix user

Top
snigelen
snigelen's picture
Level: Posting Freak
Joined: Thu. Jan 8, 2009
Posts: 1952 View posts
Location: Lund, Sweden
Posted by snigelen: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 06:06 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Define define. smiley

No recursion allowed. devil

Last Edited: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 06:07 PM
Top
awneil
awneil's picture
Level: 10k+ Postman
Joined: Fri. Jul 1, 2005
Posts: 16664 View posts
Location: Basingstoke, Hampshire, UK
Posted by awneil: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 06:49 PM (Reply to #13)
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Recursive - see: recursive.

Top Tips:

  1. How to properly post source code - see: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment... - also how to properly include images/pictures
  2. "Garbage" characters on a serial terminal are (almost?) invariably due to wrong baud rate - see: https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/serial-communication
  3. Wrong baud rate is usually due to not running at the speed you thought; check by blinking a LED to see if you get the speed you expected
  4. Difference between a crystal, and a crystal oscillator: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  5. When your question is resolved, mark the solution: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  6. Beginner's "Getting Started" tips: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
Top
larryvc
larryvc's picture
Level: Raving Lunatic
Joined: Thu. Dec 6, 2007
Posts: 4203 View posts
Location: Redmond, WA, USA
Posted by larryvc: Tue. Jan 2, 2018 - 07:43 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

From my old signature and added anew.

void transmigratus(void) {transmigratus();} // recursio infinitus 

"I may make you feel but I can't make you think" - Jethro Tull - Thick As A Brick

"void transmigratus(void) {transmigratus();} // recursio infinitus" - larryvc

"It's much more practical to rely on the processing powers of the real debugger, i.e. the one between the keyboard and chair." - JW wek3

"When you arise in the morning think of what a privilege it is to be alive: to breathe, to think, to enjoy, to love." -  Marcus Aurelius

Top
JohanEkdahl
JohanEkdahl's picture
Level: 10k+ Postman
Joined: Wed. Mar 27, 2002
Posts: 26988 View posts
Location: Lund, Sweden
Posted by JohanEkdahl: Thu. Jan 4, 2018 - 04:52 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

You've taken quite some time to try to define "instant"..

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here. 

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

Top
Kartman
Kartman's picture
Level: 10k+ Postman
Joined: Thu. Dec 30, 2004
Posts: 22735 View posts
Location: Melbourne,Australia
Posted by Kartman: Thu. Jan 4, 2018 - 11:26 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Does it take less than a microsecond to make ‘instant’ coffee?

Top
awneil
awneil's picture
Level: 10k+ Postman
Joined: Fri. Jul 1, 2005
Posts: 16664 View posts
Location: Basingstoke, Hampshire, UK
Posted by awneil: Thu. Jan 4, 2018 - 11:29 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

ISTR that "instant" photos actually took several minutes ...

Top Tips:

  1. How to properly post source code - see: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment... - also how to properly include images/pictures
  2. "Garbage" characters on a serial terminal are (almost?) invariably due to wrong baud rate - see: https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/serial-communication
  3. Wrong baud rate is usually due to not running at the speed you thought; check by blinking a LED to see if you get the speed you expected
  4. Difference between a crystal, and a crystal oscillator: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  5. When your question is resolved, mark the solution: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  6. Beginner's "Getting Started" tips: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
Top
larryvc
larryvc's picture
Level: Raving Lunatic
Joined: Thu. Dec 6, 2007
Posts: 4203 View posts
Location: Redmond, WA, USA
Posted by larryvc: Thu. Jan 4, 2018 - 11:29 PM (Reply to #16)
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

JohanEkdahl wrote:
You've taken quite some time to try to define "instant"..
It's all relative

"I may make you feel but I can't make you think" - Jethro Tull - Thick As A Brick

"void transmigratus(void) {transmigratus();} // recursio infinitus" - larryvc

"It's much more practical to rely on the processing powers of the real debugger, i.e. the one between the keyboard and chair." - JW wek3

"When you arise in the morning think of what a privilege it is to be alive: to breathe, to think, to enjoy, to love." -  Marcus Aurelius

Top
awneil
awneil's picture
Level: 10k+ Postman
Joined: Fri. Jul 1, 2005
Posts: 16664 View posts
Location: Basingstoke, Hampshire, UK
Posted by awneil: Thu. Jan 4, 2018 - 11:39 PM (Reply to #19)
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Lunchtime doubly so.

Top Tips:

  1. How to properly post source code - see: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment... - also how to properly include images/pictures
  2. "Garbage" characters on a serial terminal are (almost?) invariably due to wrong baud rate - see: https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/serial-communication
  3. Wrong baud rate is usually due to not running at the speed you thought; check by blinking a LED to see if you get the speed you expected
  4. Difference between a crystal, and a crystal oscillator: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  5. When your question is resolved, mark the solution: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  6. Beginner's "Getting Started" tips: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
Top
JohanEkdahl
JohanEkdahl's picture
Level: 10k+ Postman
Joined: Wed. Mar 27, 2002
Posts: 26988 View posts
Location: Lund, Sweden
Posted by JohanEkdahl: Fri. Jan 5, 2018 - 12:10 AM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

larryvc wrote:

JohanEkdahl wrote:
You've taken quite some time to try to define "instant"..
It's all relative

Absolutely!

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here. 

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

Top
jgmdesign
jgmdesign's picture
Level: Moderator
Joined: Mon. Mar 19, 2007
Posts: 16250 View posts
Location: Long Island New York
Posted by jgmdesign: Fri. Jan 5, 2018 - 12:12 AM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

JohanEkdahl wrote:

larryvc wrote:

JohanEkdahl wrote:
You've taken quite some time to try to define "instant"..
It's all relative

Absolutely!

 

It's all Relative.....

 

Kinda like there being an Instance in an Instant?

 

Jim

I would rather attempt something great and fail, than attempt nothing and succeed - Fortune Cookie

 

"The critical shortage here is not stuff, but time." - Johan Ekdahl

 

"Step N is required before you can do step N+1!" - ka7ehk

 

"If you want a career with a known path - become an undertaker. Dead people don't sue!" - Kartman

"Why is there a "Highway to Hell" and only a "Stairway to Heaven"? A prediction of the expected traffic load?"  - Lee "theusch"

 

Speak sweetly. It makes your words easier to digest when at a later date you have to eat them ;-)  - Source Unknown

Please Read: Code-of-Conduct

Atmel Studio6.2/AS7, DipTrace, Quartus, MPLAB, RSLogix user

Top
joeymorin
joeymorin's picture
Level: 10k+ Postman
Joined: Tue. Jul 17, 2012
Posts: 11326 View posts
Location: Location, Location
Posted by joeymorin: Fri. Jan 12, 2018 - 06:28 AM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Is a resistor a component? :P

Define 'is'.

 

BTW, nice avatar, Jim.  I see you're continuing the theme ;-)

"Experience is what enables you to recognise a mistake the second time you make it."

"Good judgement comes from experience.  Experience comes from bad judgement."

"Wisdom is always wont to arrive late, and to be a little approximate on first possession."

"When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not unicorns."

"Fast.  Cheap.  Good.  Pick two."

"We see a lot of arses on handlebars around here." - [J Ekdahl]

 

Top
frog_jr
frog_jr's picture
Level: Posting Freak
Joined: Sat. Jan 15, 2011
Posts: 1825 View posts
Location: Sugar Land, Texas
Posted by frog_jr: Fri. Jan 12, 2018 - 09:54 AM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 1

joeymorin wrote:
BTW, nice avatar, Jim.
I don't recognize East Coast Jim anymore.

I would have sworn all that hair would be pulled out by now!wink

David (aka frog_jr)

Top
JohanEkdahl
JohanEkdahl's picture
Level: 10k+ Postman
Joined: Wed. Mar 27, 2002
Posts: 26988 View posts
Location: Lund, Sweden
Posted by JohanEkdahl: Fri. Jan 12, 2018 - 02:53 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Yes, Jims avatar is traveling backwards in time. First he pulled his hair out and now his hair stands on end.

 

Or else he has a miracle cure for regaining hair - that I'd like to know of since, unfortunately, my scull has decided to traverse the time dimension in the forward direction.

 

Keeps the shampoo budget at near minimum though.. ;-)

As of January 15, 2018, Site fix-up work has begun! Now do your part and report any bugs or deficiencies here. 

No guarantees, but if we don't report problems they won't get much of  a chance to be fixed! Details/discussions at link given just above.

 

"Some questions have no answers."[C Baird] "There comes a point where the spoon-feeding has to stop and the independent thinking has to start." [C Lawson] "There are always ways to disagree, without being disagreeable."[E Weddington] "Words represent concepts. Use the wrong words, communicate the wrong concept." [J Morin] "Persistence only goes so far if you set yourself up for failure." [Kartman]

Top