Street light communication

Go To Last Post
21 posts / 0 new
Author
Message
#1
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

1. I am planing a project explaining how street light can be made more intelligent with smart batteries & other features.
2. I am thinking on what communication should I use.
3. Wired communication is not possible. As it include huge wiring
4. GSM is costly as per SMS cost is high.
5. How can I connect them wirelessly. Can I put them in network?

6. All the processing/peripheral control will be done by MCU.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

This is not new - have you spent any time reviewing how others have done it...?

 

Vindhyachal Takniki wrote:
3. Wired communication is not possible. As it include huge wiring

Eh?? Mains-borne signalling is perfectly feasible 

 

Quote:
4. GSM is costly as per SMS cost is high.

So don't use SMS, then!

Quote:
5. How can I connect them wirelessly. Can I put them in network?

Again, look at the current "State Of The Art"

 

Think about it: street lights are usually in long lines, aren't they? What does that suggest for network options...?

 

 

Top Tips:

  1. How to properly post source code - see: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment... - also how to properly include images/pictures
  2. "Garbage" characters on a serial terminal are (almost?) invariably due to wrong baud rate - see: https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/serial-communication
  3. Wrong baud rate is usually due to not running at the speed you thought; check by blinking a LED to see if you get the speed you expected
  4. Difference between a crystal, and a crystal oscillatorhttps://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  5. When your question is resolved, mark the solution: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  6. Beginner's "Getting Started" tips: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Put IR diodes and detectors on each - let them beam signals to each other - they are normally in view of each other and in a fixed position ;-)

 

(but like Andy says, they are all wired to the mains so it seems the obvious comms. channel - I use Powerline networks in my house a lot and it works really well!)

 

BTW I'm intrigued - why do they actually need to talk to one another? Do they need to tell a neighbour it's getting dark/light or something? Why can't he see that too? Or is the comms actually just from each lamp back to some master controller to report things like the need for maintenance or something?

Last Edited: Fri. Feb 27, 2015 - 09:27 AM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

clawson wrote:
Put IR diodes and detectors on each - let them beam signals to each other

There's a lot of talk these days about modulating the actual light output to transfer data...

Top Tips:

  1. How to properly post source code - see: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment... - also how to properly include images/pictures
  2. "Garbage" characters on a serial terminal are (almost?) invariably due to wrong baud rate - see: https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/serial-communication
  3. Wrong baud rate is usually due to not running at the speed you thought; check by blinking a LED to see if you get the speed you expected
  4. Difference between a crystal, and a crystal oscillatorhttps://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  5. When your question is resolved, mark the solution: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  6. Beginner's "Getting Started" tips: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

To save power some places here only every 2. are on just after dusk, then all on until midnight (or there about), and then again only every 2. until the morning.

 

And then they can tell if they don't work, so service can be done at daytime! 

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Batteries and supercapacitors degrade due to temperature variations and usage cycles.
That will limit their usefull lifetime.
Replacing n x10^6 batteries every 3 to 5 years will be expensive. (materials + human-effort)

Last Edited: Fri. Feb 27, 2015 - 10:57 AM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

mikech wrote:
Replacing n x10^6 batteries every 3 to 5 years will be expensive. (materials + human-effort)

But having good monitoring will enable that to be optimised...

Top Tips:

  1. How to properly post source code - see: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment... - also how to properly include images/pictures
  2. "Garbage" characters on a serial terminal are (almost?) invariably due to wrong baud rate - see: https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/serial-communication
  3. Wrong baud rate is usually due to not running at the speed you thought; check by blinking a LED to see if you get the speed you expected
  4. Difference between a crystal, and a crystal oscillatorhttps://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  5. When your question is resolved, mark the solution: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  6. Beginner's "Getting Started" tips: https://www.avrfreaks.net/comment...
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

awneil wrote:

There's a lot of talk these days about modulating the actual light output to transfer data...

 

And with LED street lights it becomes even easier. Although watch out for patents.

#1 Hardware Problem? https://www.avrfreaks.net/forum/...

#2 Hardware Problem? Read AVR042.

#3 All grounds are not created equal

#4 Have you proved your chip is running at xxMHz?

#5 "If you think you need floating point to solve the problem then you don't understand the problem. If you really do need floating point then you have a problem you do not understand."

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

awneil wrote:
There's a lot of talk these days about modulating the actual light output to transfer data...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Li-Fi

"Experience is what enables you to recognise a mistake the second time you make it."

"Good judgement comes from experience.  Experience comes from bad judgement."

"Wisdom is always wont to arrive late, and to be a little approximate on first possession."

"When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not unicorns."

"Fast.  Cheap.  Good.  Pick two."

"We see a lot of arses on handlebars around here." - [J Ekdahl]

 

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Actually, is this a discussion about "Stop Lights", Red/Yellow/Green; or is this a discussion about "Streetlights", that light up intersections and roadways?

 

Streetlights generally don't have much "smarts", except for on/off based upon the ambient lighting.

Sometimes entire banks are controlled simultaneously, but that isn't necessary.

 

Stop Lights, however, usually ARE networked, so as to control the flow of traffic in an orderly manner and optimize traffic throughput.

 

JC

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Also, I'd be interested in hearing more about how smart batteries will help with either kind of lighting.

 

Both devices, streetlights and Stop Lights, draw a huge current, and are Mains powered.

If one loses the Main's power, either from a wide area power outage, or from a car crashing into the control box, there won't be any light, and hence no need to control it.

Perhaps there would be an improvement by the light automatically reporting its failure back to the department that is responsible for them.

 

Temperatures were recently down around -24'C, (~-11'F), locally, and Ohio isn't one of the "cold" areas in the USA.

In July and August the temperatures sore, certainly over 100'F inside the control boxes, and Ohio isn't one of the "hot" areas in the USA.

 

Generally not a great environment for batteries, especially with Mains power readily available.

 

JC

 

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Traffic lights are already pretty smart, and they already communicate with one another through a wireless network.

 

Security firm IOActive recently did a series of papers concerning vulnerabilities in common traffic control systems, and this video shows what kind of data you can get from a simple laptop with a transceiver attached:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=...

 

They even were able to completely alter traffic lights in a controlled (isolated light, no cars on street) experiment from a drone flying a few hundred feet over the intersection.

 

So traffic control systems are already too smart for their own good, and barely secured in most instances.

Last Edited: Fri. Feb 27, 2015 - 05:42 PM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

DocJC wrote:
Both devices, streetlights and Stop Lights, draw a huge current, and are Mains powered.
Seeing more LED traffic lights.

DocJC wrote:
If one loses the Main's power, either from a wide area power outage, or from a car crashing into the control box, there won't be any light, and hence no need to control it.
One rechargeable battery R&D/low-rate-production entity states use of its subC cells for traffic lights.

DocJC wrote:
Perhaps there would be an improvement by the light automatically reporting its failure back to the department that is responsible for them.
Seems every traffic department light truck is stocked with a laptop; laptop likely has a cellular phone modem and maybe a short range wireless transceiver to query the traffic light control and maybe the street light control also.

Each driver probably has a route or territory so as each drives the data could be queried/responsed without any action from the driver.

The short range wireless may be 802.15.4 and 2.4GHz; the antennas on top of the intersections (outer boundary) do not appear to be for 900MHz and the antennas on top of the control boxes are somewhat short.

DocJC wrote:
In July and August the temperatures sore, certainly over 100'F inside the control boxes, and Ohio isn't one of the "hot" areas in the USA.
Some control boxes are on concrete pedestals above the sidewalk well away from the curb and inset on the pedestal; appear to be reasonably protected but some light cars do clear the curb by a significant height due to a high energy impact.

Other boxes don't have the space for this and are semi-buried into the sidewalk with flush lids indicating something similar to traffic control caution high voltage.

The pavement-assisted air temperature here can probably approach 50C (122F); record low here is about 0F (-18C).

Placing the batteries onto or near soil would minimize the temperature exposure.

Most batteries are sealed and likewise with the connections; might withstand some short duration submersion.


PowerGenix Batteries

Cells

http://powergenix.com/cells/

SubC: NiZn SubC is deployed in traffic control systems throughout North America

 PowerGenix Batteries

Traffic UPS

http://powergenix.com/traffic-ups/

...

A major challenge with nearly all traffic industry transportation cabinets is limited or no space available for installing a Battery Backup System (BBS).

"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

sparrow2 wrote:
To save power ...
What I've noticed here is :

  • Retrofit - as a street lamp (sodium vapor?) fails its shade/reflector/bulb assembly is replaced but by LEDs; compatible mount with the street lamp pole.
  • Road-bed reconstruction - nearly ready-to-go street lamps, circular shade, multi-LED clusters, one for road and one for sidewalk, bit bright to look at even in daytime during testing.

"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Maybe I'm wrong, but aren't those batteries for the controller, not the light itself?

My point was that even with the LED replacement lights, the system isn't viable on battery power.

If you lose your Mains, your out of luck, and light.

 

Many towns have 3M's traffic preemption system for emergency vehicles.

The old opticons just flashed a UV light at 14 Hz.

When people started hacking them, some opted for the higher tech "encoded" UV flashers to trigger the traffic lights for the emergency vehicles.

 

My town was an early adopter for the next generation system.

It is GPS controlled.

The box in the vehicle monitors the vehicle's position, direction of travel, speed, etc., and even the turn signals.

 

As one approaches an intersection it will clear the  intersection, and on complex intersections will even clear specific lanes based upon the turn signal in the emergency vehicle.

Very cool.

 

Many, many bad intersection accidents occur, unfortunately, with emergency vehicles.

Always traveling with a green light reduces one's risk tremendously.

 

Yet another "trivial" invention I wish I had the patent for, but unfortunately don't.

 

I'm seeing more and more of the LED replacement street lights, also.

 

JC

 

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Vindhyachal Takniki wrote:
5. How can I connect them wirelessly. Can I put them in network?
Yes.

Mesh networks can be used to increase the extent of a network.

Some relatively long range wireless transceivers have a network mode.

Range is increased by adjusting modulation, increasing antenna gain, decreasing baud (I've forgot some; been a long time since the information theory couse).


For the following, let the page's slide show roll; you'll get some ideas some of which have already been mentioned.

Contiki: The Open Source Operating System for the Internet of Things

http://www.contiki-os.org/

2.4GHz, 9600bps UART, network up to 60 transceivers, good to excellent range, value is TBD :

http://rfdigital.com/

"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller

Last Edited: Sat. Feb 28, 2015 - 03:39 AM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

DocJC wrote:
Maybe I'm wrong, but aren't those batteries for the controller, not the light itself?

My point was that even with the LED replacement lights, the system isn't viable on battery power.

If you lose your Mains, your out of luck, and light.

Found the URL for the traffic signal UPS manufacturer from the PowerGenix ref.

The traffic signal UPS datasheet states that the inverter's power rating is 1kW, 1.5kW for 10m, 3kW for a short duration.

The battery panel data is 300W/panel or 500W/panel; up to 16 panels into a hub.

Is 1kW enough to traffic light an intersection?


Traffic Signal UPS | Back-Up Power | Battery Back-Up System

Products

http://www.blueeartheps.com/Products.html

...

Data Sheet

http://www.blueeartheps.com/EPS-DataSheet__Traffic_.pdf

"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

Lots of traffic signal controllers use cellular to be remotely managed.

 

low volume/telemetry cellular data plans for signals, HVAC, alarms, kiosks, etc... are as low as US$2-3  per month.

 

Of course, none of these kinds of users pay ordinary consumer data service rates.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

stevech wrote:
low volume/telemetry cellular data plans for signals, HVAC, alarms, kiosks, etc... are as low as US$2-3  per month.
An off-the-shelf shows about 4USD/mon for 12mon 1MB :

Digi-Key

Pre-Paid SIM Cards for T-Mobile® - Jazz Wireless Data Inc

http://www.digikey.com/product-highlights/en/prepaid-sim-cards-for-tmobile/52046?WT.z_Tab_Cat=Featured%20Products

Edit : typo

"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller

Last Edited: Sat. Feb 28, 2015 - 06:06 AM
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

I had searched for some cheap solution.
Solution I have got till now, get SIM module, use GPRS and send the data on network. Lowest cost
No SMS

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Total votes: 0

http://www.semitechsemi.com

There's also a number of other companies in this space. There's a chinese company that has a dirt cheap mains comms chip - the name escapes me. Then you could have an aggregation point with gprs.