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 Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 03:02 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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Friday morning, Steptember 7th, 0600 - the end of the work shift.
Just before quitting time, I was brought to the front office.
There, I was notified that "As you know, we are implimenting the ARDS (Automated Robotic Distribution System). We will be need to absorb 32 employees into the work force. We will need to let you go to help equalize the absorbtion of extra workers."
I received one of those wimpy (pukey) handshakes and was wished good luck.
Well... That is it! I am now unemployed. It's sad because, I busted my ass there while, so many just sat around and watched me. Yet, I have to go and, they get to stay. That is the way barganing units (Unions) work.
Like the rest of the U.S. work force, I'm 30 days from finantial disaster - typical but, no ones fault but my own.
I don't know what I'll be doing. I'm taking the weekend to update my resume and think about what I want to do with the last 7 to 10 yeard of my working career.
I'm sharing this, only because it becomes the sequill to my getting hired at this job.
I'm looking at this with the mindset that, while it currently looks bad, this could turn into something much better, in the end.
Any suggestion or pointers are welcom!
Also, and small contract work or other work that could help keep me a-float while I secure new employment would be greately appreciated.
The saga continues... |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 03:04 PM |
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Joined: Dec 15, 2003
Posts: 4403
Location: Slovakia, Bratislava
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Oh my...isn't your old position still opened?
Good luck finding another one and a better one. |
_________________
There are pointy haired bald people.
Time flies when you have a bad prescaler selected.
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 03:23 PM |
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Joined: Nov 01, 2005
Posts: 6324
Location: Hilversum - the Netherlands
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That's hard ... very hard. Sorry to hear this. Of course it's good to think that it will probably turn out in something better, but nevertheless it's sad at this very moment.
Nard |
_________________
Dragon broken ? Or problems with the Parallel Port Programmer ? Scroll down on my projects-page http://www.aplomb.nl/TechStuff/TechStuff.html for tips
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 03:49 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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David,
My old position was filled, the Monday following my resignation.
Nard,
Oddly, in 1989 I took a job with McDonnell Douglas. It was a great job. I was hired to work as a CNC (Computer Numerical Control) machine technician in a secured area, having to do with the A-12 stealth bomber. The day after I started working there, Congress canceled the project. Two weeks later, layoffs started in California. As I worked at the Tulsa facility, I was concerned. I was told not to worry, that "No lay-offs will come to the Tulsa plant!" Well, 6 days after I finished my probation, I was layed off. As I was there long enough to receive call-back rights, I couldn't find a job because, every employer in Tulsa knew that, when I got called back, I'd leave and go back to McDonnell Douglas. I was unemployed for over a year. I eventually lost my house, my cars, and most of my electronics lab. This was incredablly devestating.
But, as bad sas it apeared (those were only physical things) I ended up using my time by going to college and getting an Electronics Technology Degree. That was a good thing, though, I can't say that I benifited a whole lot finantially, I gained a lot of personal satisfaction. Having the degree has opened some doors for me but, not usually for getting the type of job that I really want - embedded design. I usually have to take some other type of position and, after prooving myself (once again), I wiesle myself into a nitch position that just wasn't available to me coming in the door.
My son wants me to break out on my own but, with out at least a years finantial backing, the likelyhood of success is NILL. Most individuals who break out on their own either have enough money or have been doing it on the side and have a good network in place, or both. I have neither, except AVRFreaks. That's right! AVRFreaks is the only users group that I belong to. There is no reason to go elsewhere.
So, I'm just (rambling to some) thinking out loud. Maybe in doing so, something will make some sort of sense to me.
As I said, oninions and suggestions are very much welcome. |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 04:11 PM |
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Joined: Sep 04, 2002
Posts: 21271
Location: Orlando Florida
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| Does Cincinatti Milacron actually make NC milling machines in Cincinatti, or do they just send a box car down to the docks to get a Japanese machine? Is there any factory anywhere in Ohio or Illinois that makes anything anymore, or is the whole country just in "Outsource all actual jobs to a place with 1/10th the labor rate so we can watch a DVD on a Chinese player that costs $30 instead of $300" mode? That was a good tradeoff wasn't it? Shut down the steel, auto, motorcycle, TV, camera, clothing and every other industry so we can buy cheep stuff made in sweatshops. It seems to me that a guy that can build a computerized milling machine outght to be able to get a job building stuff that is useful. Think a section on freaks for contract sw opportunites would get any positions posted? Is any employer savvy enough to tap into a talent pool like that? |
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Imagecraft compiler user
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 04:14 PM |
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Joined: Dec 15, 2003
Posts: 4403
Location: Slovakia, Bratislava
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Quote:
Think a section on freaks for contract sw opportunites would get any positions posted? Is any employer savvy enough to tap into a talent pool like that?
uuuh...gooood idea! |
_________________
There are pointy haired bald people.
Time flies when you have a bad prescaler selected.
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 04:22 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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bobgardner wrote:
Does Cincinatti Milacron actually make NC milling machines in Cincinatti, or do they just send a box car down to the docks to get a Japanese machine?
Oddly, the Cincinnati Malacron main office is about 6 miles from my house! There is also a Milacron manufacturing facility about 6 miles from my house but, in the opposite direction. Cincinnati Milacron is mostely into plastic extrusion machines these days. Milacron hasn't made a CNC machine tool in years. In fact, they recently stopped supporting the repair of any type of machine tool.
I've applied at Milacron at least a dozen times within the past 12 years. The response is, I'm over qualified (read, I make too much money or, I'm too old)!
I'll send them another resume but, I'd be stunned if I actually got a real interview. |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 04:36 PM |
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Joined: Nov 17, 2004
Posts: 6137
Location: Great Smokey Mountains.
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Carl,
I am really sorry to hear about this.
I'm tempted to go off on a rant about the state of business management and it's total lack of humanity, but it won't do any good. Once upon a time I despised unions and thought the Europeans were a bunch of communists for the way they protected workers -- now I think that unions are just realists in that they screw the company because they know the company will screw them and the the Europeans may be sacrificing some in flexibility, but that it is worth it in protecting human beings. Our government seems dedicated to screwing the middle class out of existence. The illegal aliens are taking the low level jobs and the mid level jobs are being exported and outsourced. I'm beginning to think the whole 'War on Terror' thing is just a ruse to build an infrastructure to keep American Citizens from rebelling as we come to realize just how screwed we really are by big business and big government. Screw the greedy bastards, and start voting for anybody but an entrenched incumbent. Any unknown half crazy candidate would, in my opinion be better than any of the bastards feeding off lobbyists and campaign donors that we have now. We have got to figure out some way to develop a voice and power for the individual working people in this nation and take the power away from the rich and the victim groups. Looks like I may be off on a rant anyway.
You are a smart hard worker and for folks like you to get screwed like this is not an indication that there is anything wrong with you, but an indictment of our systems of doing business and governance. How on earth can a big company like yours hire you away from a stable job and then dump you so quickly and callously? This is an indication of something that is truly evil - that is by looking at people, not as humans but as commodities, these guys have the souls of slaveholders and deserve to be damned for their lack of concern for humanity. Okay, more ranting - no real use, but I just hate to see good people get hurt while the malignant sociopaths who manage these business get bonuses.
My advice: when you do get your next job, do whatever is necessary to live way below your means, develop a lifestyle that you can sustain at a fraction of you income, then save like crazy. This kind of * is happening to lots of folks nowadays and it is no longer safe to live off your income expecting it to be a constant flow. I'd tell anyone to live off less than half their income, save for these inevitable screw jobs, and as soon as you accumulate enough wealth to go out on your own, then do it.
Smiley |
_________________
FREE TUTORIAL: 'Quick Start Guide for Using the WinAVR C Compiler with ATMEL's AVR Butterfly' AVAILABLE AT: http://www.smileymicros.com
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 04:59 PM |
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Joined: Aug 23, 2003
Posts: 255
Location: West Midlands, U.K
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Carl, I'm so sorry to read this - it all looked so good when you moved there.
I've just recently managed to find a position after 5 months of searching and it has been much tougher than I thought it would be.
The only things I can suggest are to keep positive, you WILL find something else, and if my experience in the UK is anything to go by - avoid agencies like the plague as most seem hell bent on wasting your time and getting as much information from you that will help them find jobs (and hence a nice finders fee...) for other people.
From what I know of you here on 'Freaks, you have a mass of knowledge & experience and seem to be well equipped (pcb mill etc) - could you not go freelance, designing hardware/software prototypes ? It has to be worth a try, even just to keep the wolf from the door whilst you're looking.
I'm sure that there are some 'Freaks here who are a wizz with Dreamweaver etc and could assist with a website design for you to assist drumming up business (sadly not me otherwise I'd gladly help)
Good luck !
Regards,
Robin |
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 05:23 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
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Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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Thanks Joe!
You're not ranting because, what you said is the truth.
I'll take it a step further... I'm goining to vote for anybody who is nobody! I'm tired of the "Fat Cats" and their own purposes being served - and not the peoples needs.
Well, I'll be living off of credit cards, until I find my next job. Fortunately they were all paid off and all have at least $7,000.00 of credit availablity. It's scary but, that's the way it's got to be.
My middle son, (the one who just became an officer in the U.S> Navy) has offered me $10,000.00 to start a business. The problem is, I don't know if that is possible. No one knows who I am and, I have no human networking set up - save AVRFreaks.net.
I'm almost tempted to just go for broke and take Timothy up on his offer. If I succede, great! If I fail, what will society do, squeeze blood from a turnip?
Having lost all before, I know the hardships involved. This time at worst, I'll loose the house but, the master plan was that my wife and I would retire and live in our 35 foot travel trailor. That plan may need to be moved up 7 to 10 years - living in the travel trailor, as we already have it sitting in the yard.
I've contacted Tom (ZoomCityZoom) for advice as, I know he broke out on his own. While just jumping into business for myself might not be feasable at this particular juncture, I do think I need to start building a network, beyond AVRFreaks.
The sad fact is, I should have been agressively working on building up the networking quite some time ago and, maybe not spending so much time on AVRFreaks.
I can service some needs, even for the AVRFreaks community but, I can't do it for the "Slave Rate" prices that China offers. There is just no incentive to come to me to do business, when a Chineese company can under bid me at a ratio of 100:1. That and the fact that no one knows me except those here on AVRFreaks.
I mean, being an AVRFreak, would you come to me for a quality PCB lay-out, knowing that you can get the same thing 10, 50, 100 time cheaper from a Chineese company? I don't think so. Besides, I can only do single sifed PCBs at a Hobby quality level.
I've thought about custom design. I have a real nack for solving manufacturing problems using embedded design. But who know me? Who knows my work? Who will I use for a reference - Schwan's, AVRFreaks, my mother - who thinks I'm a genious???
And I am beginning to think something is wrong with me! Not in the sense that I am socially dis-functional. Rather, I can't seem to get where I want to go. I really struggle with someone sitting around doing next to nothing, while the junior guy busts his ass and, in the end, the junior guy has to go because of something called sieniority! That is what is wrong with our society! We have it so good that, we can't even see that we are throwing everything away with our complacency and lazyness. We simply desirve what is shortly coming our way.
The saving grace is, I know when the whole mess finally does fall apart, I'll be prepaired to cut them (the lazy bastards) out of the next job because, they can't meet the work ethics and I'll be taking to that job. If they do get a job, it'll be for far less money and, their so physically out of shape, they'll keel over with a heart attack on the first or second day!
When the economy slides back far enough, Miller won't be selling beer, Schwan's won't be selling frozen foods, GM, Ford, Chrystler, Toyota, etc... won't be selling cars. They, and companies like them, will be laying off the same lazy bastards who were the primary cause for those comapnies having to raise their priceses so far beyond reach.
I'll be posting something in the "Trading Post" section of the forum and see if there is any interst in my services. Some money coming in while I'm looking for new enployment is better then none at all. I'm just not sure whether it should be specific services or, broad and general services.
Thanks for the moral support - to all of the AVRFreaks community!!!
Thanks Joe! |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 05:41 PM |
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Joined: Jul 10, 2006
Posts: 2655
Location: Minneapolis
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Like everyone else I am shocked and saddened by your situation Carl, and wish you the best of luck going forward. My chosen career path of late is a contract developer which makes me vulnerable to immediate layoff and periods of unemployment. My "out" is that if necessary I can leave the family for a few months and take lucrative, short term assignment in (pick remote area).
Smiley wrote:
but that it is worth it in protecting human beings
Not sure how you can claim this when the sitation at hand clearly demonstrates the unions protect mediocrity thereby providing one more entity one may expect to be screwed by.
Smiley wrote:
they know the company will screw them
A lesson I should have learned much earlier and should be taught to young people. If you allow it, you will be screwed! By family, friends, government, employers, coworkers, neighbors....
Rule #1: Look out for your own interests above all else. Demand the raises, play bidding employers against each other and take care of you and yours.
Rule #2: Provide diligent and valuable contributions to your business associates (employers, customers) to the extent possible without violating Rule #1.
Don't expect loyalty or even praise despite how deserving you are. Put money in the bank and keep surveying the landscape, both to spot better opportunities AND to foresee catastrophe.
Oh how I wish I knew this stuff at a younger age! |
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 05:46 PM |
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Joined: Jan 03, 2006
Posts: 4417
Location: Hemel Hemsptead, UK
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Carl - I don't have a lot to offer, except encouragement. I'm in a different country with different rules... but what I will suggest is that your unique selling point is, in spite of what you think, your design and problem solving skills. You might not be able to match the outsourced *build* prices, but being close to the problem gives you a hell of an advantage in getting *exactly* what the client wants.
Yes, get the CV out there - as many places as you can - but in the time that you're not writing letters, get on to the electronics magazines. Got an innovative use? Write it up, pictures, and get it in the hobby mags - because that gives you something to point to on your CV, gives you something to discuss when you get the placement interviews, and gets your name visible and noticed.
Best of luck with it.
Neil |
_________________
Neil Barnes
www.nailed-barnacle.co.uk
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 06:10 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
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Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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cpluscon wrote:
Smiley wrote:
but that it is worth it in protecting human beings
Not sure how you can claim this when the sitation at hand clearly demonstrates the unions protect mediocrity thereby providing one more entity one may expect to be screwed by.
The sad fact is, I should have learned this with McDonnell Douglas but, I didn't! "Screw me once, shame on you! Screw me twice, shame on me!!!"
cpluscon wrote:
Rule #1: Look out for your own interests above all else. Demand the raises, play bidding employers against each other and take care of you and yours.
Rule #2: Provide diligent and valuable contributions to your business associates (employers, customers) to the extent possible without violating Rule #1.
Don't expect loyalty or even praise despite how deserving you are. Put money in the bank and keep surveying the landscape, both to spot better opportunities AND to foresee catastrophe.
Oh how I wish I knew this stuff at a younger age!
You and me both!!!
But, I have this querk. You see, I'll see the hand coming into play, long before it is actually played out and, I'll let it be played out. Call me a fool, if you will but, it's not that I don't or won't believe it. It's that, I have to give everyone the benifit of my doubt. I know that a lot of the time I come off on the AVRFreaks forum as a "Pompus Ass" but, in my personal life, it's not really that way. I'll knowingly let indivinuals take advantage of the situation. Then, I'll let them do it again. I am the type of person who, wears his feeling out on my shirt cuff. What you see is what you get - at face value. I'll blow off over something but, once I do blow off, it's in the past. I don't hold grudges! I figure that, if you screw me, their is a bigger fish, just waiting to screw you.
Is this passivism or complacency? I don't know. Most things just aren't worth getting into a frenzy about and, ruining your health.
Am I in trouble by being unemployed? Probably! But it's very early. I don't know what the outcome will be. Will this hurt finantially? Probably! Will I recover? Eventually!
Today, I have a roof over my head, the bills are current, my wife and children love and respect me.
Tomorrow, I may loose the house and cars. But I will have a place to sleep and, my wife and children will still love me. In fact, two of my sons have offered what help they can afford, the third son doesn't know about my loosing my job yet and, my daughter and her husband have already offered to move the 35 foot trailor along side of their home.
So, what can they take form me if I can't find a job?
You can't squeeze blood out of a Turnip!
I have more then most in society - a wife and children who love me! And that beats all!!! |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 07:07 PM |
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Joined: Sep 04, 2002
Posts: 21271
Location: Orlando Florida
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There are those aggressive 'Type A' personalities that change lanes with no turn signal, butt in line at the post office etc. Maybe you're a more laid back type, willing to go with the flow. The Type As make good salesmen I think. Get one on your team if you have a selling job.
Supposedly its a big world, room for different types. (Even wierd beards with rusty knives? naaaah.... you can only stretch so far) |
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Imagecraft compiler user
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 07:10 PM |
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Joined: Sep 03, 2004
Posts: 379
Location: Silicon Valley
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microcarl wrote:
Thanks Joe!
Well, I'll be living off of credit cards, until I find my next job. Fortunately they were all paid off and all have at least $7,000.00 of credit availablity. It's scary but, that's the way it's got to be.
Hi microcarl;
I am going to stop lurking here for a moment and advise against maxing out the credit cards. I did this back in 1989 and it really messed things up. I think this may be a reason why I am currently having diverticulitis landing a payroll job.
A credit check is now part of the hiring practices, done in the name of security. In these days bad credit means someone who may be a risk and might possibly embezzle or is a "Failure" that is not the "winner" the company needs.
Cut those credit cards NOW. Pretend the roof caved in at this moment. There is no point in denial. Waiting a month is wasting a month. That said take a moment to smell the fall colors in the air. But take advantage of the good weather and prepare while you can, and not by borrowing.
Now the 1990s were good to me (I worked for Apple as both contract and full time.) In 2001/2002 I was working in Elizabethtown KY (Not too far from Cincinnati, when measured by California distances.)
Even when I was pulling in close to 6 figures a year the black marks on my credit remained an issue. Paying it back via a TRW loan took years.
When I was laid off in 2002, The first thing I did was cut up the one credit card I had. This time I had taken the advice and saved up 10 months or more of monthly expenses. That allowed me to live in my Silicon Valley apartment for an additional year where I taught myself AVR and MIDI control.
I then blew the last two months of rent on a project that did not sell. I doubt if I would do different if I had the time over again. The problem was I held on too long to too many things.
These days I am staying (Leeching?) off friends and relations (My parents give me house room in the basement and a bit of shop space) Making just enough off consulting to maintain my car insurance and storage fees for my books. My parents were children in WWII so we still have a "Victory Garden" to supplement the shared food.
There has been a lot of press lately as the County my Parents worked for, has Lifetime medical and other retirement. The bean counters want to cut this as they see hundreds of millions in the retirement accounts. This "they"[1] want to loot and use to pay the balloon payments on their bad credit practice.
The current administration says it is "Family based" I would agree with that, cause I had to move back in with my family due to the gutting of the social safety net. Good thing my dad had to join a union when he did. (The Family was Hoover Republican, till Regan ascended the throne. We got Regenomics and the closed insane asylums in California first.)
The government now promotes Christian values. So one has to take the advice in the bible and sell ones possessions at a loss, in order to remain un-encumbered and quick to travel.
In the 19th century, when people were in "Reduced circumstance" They would live off bread and butter, augmented by thick beer. Not the most pleasurable experience, but it does keep one alive, the costs down (If one purchaces day or two day old bread.) If butter is too dear, the Italian immigrants would use vinegar an oil on the bread. Sometimes they would supplement this with a sausage. Fall is the time to lay in a supply of the old foods, but do not purchase food on credit. Sell something to eat, not easy but that is what the bible and other related books say to do.
Just realize, that if you can not sell all your nearest and dearest possessions, then you will have difficulty selling yourself or what ever startup product you have industry to implement.
I know because I have been there and done that and now have a tee-shirt press, in case I want to sell something someone needs.
Oh, and don't forget to smile. That is something engineers often forget to do.
-julie
[1] Newspaper editorials paid for by political lobbyists. |
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 07:18 PM |
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Joined: Nov 10, 2005
Posts: 1527
Location: Redmond, WA
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Carl, I'm sorry to hear of your situation. Call me when you get a chance.
Tom (509)251-1106 |
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 07:28 PM |
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Joined: Jul 10, 2006
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Location: Minneapolis
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Quote:
advise against maxing out the credit cards
Listen in earnest, young'ens lest ye be enslaved by the evil money lenders. Talk about getting screwed!
Quote:
to the gutting of the social safety net
Carl has it right IMO. Ultimately we are responsible for our own fate. Blaming others is futile. |
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 07:31 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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Thanks Julie...
The sad fact is, other then the last pay check (not yet received) there is no reserve. As I mentioned with the McDonnell Douglas debacle, back then, I did sell everything. My whole workbench and about 600 technical books got me about $1,500 in cold cash. Back then, our grand scheme was, we borrowed $6,000.00 from my mother and that, along with the $1,500.00 allowed us to purchase a 28 foot Bunk House style RV travel trailor. Six of us lived in that for over 5 years. We already have the 35 foot trailor and, it will not be going as, my wifes income will pupprot the trailor and Jeep payment.
I am prepaired to do this again but, what will they do, put me in jail for trying to survive? If I sell all of my equipment and parts, I probably wouldn't get anymore then I did back in the late 1980s. I'll let the house and cars go but, I'm afraid that the equipment stays this time - it is the only real chance that I will have to gain independance. There is probably several hundred thousdand dollars layed out in equipment and parts over the past 12 to 15 years. I'll not be giving it up this time. They''ll have to come and take it from me. It's all paid for and can become quire transparent to those greedy bastards. I can sell all day long and, win all of the contracts out there but, if I can't produce, its all for NOT.
But I do appreciate your advice. Maybe I'll get lucky before things go too far adrift. |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
Last edited by microcarl on Sep 08, 2007 - 07:36 PM; edited 1 time in total
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 07:35 PM |
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Joined: Sep 03, 2004
Posts: 379
Location: Silicon Valley
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microcarl wrote:
Tomorrow, I may loose the house and cars. But I will have a place to sleep and, my wife and children will still love me. In fact, two of my sons have offered what help they can afford, the third son doesn't know about my loosing my job yet and, my daughter and her husband have already offered to move the 35 foot trailor along side of their home.
Hi Again Carl;
An Adendum. Call your lender now, and contact your congressional representatives staff people. And I mean NOW. Log off and do this.
There are plans in the works I heard on the radio (If one trusts NPR) that if one is up front with the lender there are some sort of federal programs to help differ this "Mortgage Crisis" The commentator was noting that too many people wait until it is too late, max out their lines of credit etc.
Most borrowers are afraid to talk to the lender. When in 1991 my homeowners association foreclosed on me I called the lender and worked out a plan (The HA had no teeth because the lender had priority.) I was able to keep the place an wait for a market upturn and sold only when I had worked for a year. The last thing the lender wants is a default and a property they must sell at a loss. Especially in this market where there are more homes available than buyers.
Be polite, honest and up front. I know the IRS has something called a Taxpayer advocate, which helped my sort out some issues when I was hit with SSI taxes and income average 77,000 a year to 1,200 a year.
There are programs but one needs to act sooner than later.
-jP |
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 07:52 PM |
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Joined: Jul 10, 2006
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Location: Minneapolis
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How about teaching at a technical school like DeVry etc? Could be a part time gig or night class so your day is open for job search and/or starting a biz.
Consider a contract (temp) job. There can be less scrutiny over age and such for these positions and the pay can be quite good. (I know one guy that works all winter and takes the summer off to dink around in his shop.) Also, "4 month" projects often last much longer. I've even seen a company lay off fulltimers just to hire them back on contract for higher wages! (Apparently this makes sense to bean counters....) |
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 08:05 PM |
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Joined: Feb 14, 2007
Posts: 1858
Location: San Diego California
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Carl I’m really sorry, this sucks!!
microcarl wrote:
... I'm looking at this with the mindset that, while it currently looks bad, this could turn into something much better, in the end.
...
But great attitude, I can’t help thinking your talents were wasted there and you will be much happier doing something you enjoy very soon. I would encourage you to look for a job but also setup a business of your own even if just to deduct your hobby and gain experience in marketing your services. It’s harder to do both but many have achieved successful results without living in poverty at all. Also don’t discount the letters of recommendation that many of the Freaks would probably be willing to write for you. I would ask the Freaks and use them!!!
I too have noticed your ability to problem solve. Lets try and exploit that talent.
Starting a new business is about (location for some) but for your services it’s marketing and advertising. This doesn’t take that much money it just takes consistence mailings of marketing letters to every conceivable prospect. A rule of thumb is for every 100 ‘prospects’ you send a letter to you will receive 10 requests form ‘suspects’ interested in your services and from those 10 suspects you can expect to make one sale.
I would send letters to all the usual electronic firms offering sub-contract overflow assistance from your new business. But you are uniquely qualified to offer a new service. Lets use the same thing that got you fired (automation) to get hired automating other company’s manufacturing procedures. This is a wide-open field and is the future of US companies who wish to stay in business, as it’s the only way the US can compete with cheap labor and survive. Offer a free automation review of their manufacturing facility. Offer to increase production and decrease costs and see how many suspects you get. You don’t have to re-invent the wheel you can learn the equipment and use off the shelf stuff. This can be as simple as adding temperature logs for better quality control to full robotic plans. With the right marketing I feel you would thrive in this industry.
One last suggestion, always (at least slightly) change your letters and when you advertise always place two different adds in the same publication with different email, phone numbers, or contact names like ask for Mr. Silver or Mr. Gold in the other.
Keep track of which add got the most response. Use the winning add next month and re-write the looser always trying to find the best words to brings in the most suspected clients.
If you need any business advice PM me and I’ll give you my phone number I can walk you through the steps involved in setting up a business, marketing, etc and would be pleased to consult for free.
Best of luck in all you do,
John
PS:
I was a CPA and did this for a living, just many years ago. |
_________________
Resistance is futile…… You will be compiled!
Last edited by AllN on Sep 08, 2007 - 09:37 PM; edited 1 time in total
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 08:20 PM |
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Joined: Sep 03, 2004
Posts: 379
Location: Silicon Valley
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microcarl wrote:
Thanks Julie...
The sad fact is, other then the last pay check (not yet received) there is no reserve. As I mentioned with the McDonnell Douglas debacle, back then, I did sell everything. My whole workbench and about 600 technical books got me about $1,500 in cold cash. Back then, our grand scheme was, we borrowed $6,000.00 from my mother and that, along with the $1,500.00 allowed us to purchase a 28 foot Bunk House style RV travel trailor. Six of us lived in that for over 5 years. We already have the 35 foot trailor and, it will not be going as, my wifes income will pupprot the trailor and Jeep payment.
I am prepaired to do this again but, what will they do, put me in jail for trying to survive? If I sell all of my equipment and parts, I probably wouldn't get anymore then I did back in the late 1980s. I'll let the house and cars go but, I'm afraid that the equipment stays this time - it is the only real chance that I will have to gain independance. There is probably several hundred thousdand dollars layed out in equipment and parts over the past 12 to 15 years. I'll not be giving it up this time. They''ll have to come and take it from me. It's all paid for and can become quire transparent to those greedy bastards. I can sell all day long and, win all of the contracts out there but, if I can't produce, its all for NOT.
But I do appreciate your advice. Maybe I'll get lucky before things go too far adrift.
More addendum. (Hopefully you are contacting your creditors and congressional staff people. If the radio is correct congress is debating the "Mortgage meltdown" and proposing legislation to keep their lender cronies from holding onto a lot of unsellable property. Best to get in early on these programs before they snowball.)
Agree on the keeping the tools and books. I pay 100 buck a month to store my books, as most are rare technical books on watches clocks, pipe organ building and automata. My current mentor, who is teaching me pipe organ repair, has a van and practically lives out of it. He then leaves the large tools, such as the contractors saw and drill press at the clients.
Just be ready if you can get "replacement cost and food" for a tool be willing to part with it and replace it My mentor loaned me a radial arm saw I was (No longer made by sears due to product liability.) Another mentor came along and gave me one for free. I was loath to replace the saw as with it I could sub contract some repairs myself.
The only tool I am unwilling to part with, (Unless a replacement can be had.) Is the Oscope. We are lucky that an AVR can be programmed with a paper clip and a parallel port on an old PC. A Butterfly demo turned into a Boot loader or JTAG ICE.
These days I also tend to do development (prototype work) for the cost of a PC board and parts. Lately one of my clients has even been placing the Mouser and Digikey orders, with the parts shipped to my stable address.
As for incarceration. Dickens's family was jailed in the 1820s for debt. With the publication of Oliver Twist in 1836 (Chuck was 24 at the time.) Parlimentry reform happened and by the 1850s they stopped jailing (gaoling?) debtors. Then old Reagan and Gingrich came along and tried to return the system back to the 1830s. A lot of the social protections of Marx and Lennon that FDR implemented have been slowly chipped away. No you will not be gaoled, insted like Little Nell and her grandfather, you will starve to death shoe less in a snowbank in a norther industrial town. Or like Stephen, Blackpool, fall down a mineshaft and break your neck.
Better the Fate Of Wilkins Mcawber, friend of David Copperfield. While Gaoled for debt ("Welcome Misery, Welcome Houslessness, Welcome Hunger, Our company will keep us to the end,") He wound up Governor of Australia.
Did anyone notice that Napoleon finally made it to America? (He was captured in a boat on his way.) In the old days they used to lock up people who thought they were Napoleon in asylums. Now they are president of these united states and is the Peninsular wars of Spain all over again. Complete with surge columns, walls and siege strategy.
[edit cause I forgot that I wanted to say, then digressed here, Now thanks to Regan, the crazies are running the country and the sane people live in asylums called "Country Clubs."]
I think what happened in Belgium, is mostly forgotten. I remember that there was a lot of dancing at the Congress of Vienna, and Arthur Wesley went to a Cyprians Party the night before the German troops arrived. But that was Belgium. Spain on the other hand was left to itself. Older people remember Franco, and that was 100 years later!
Still even Bonaparte and Tallyrand knew better than to attack Pasha Sellim III or whomever the Grand Turk and Ottoman emperor was then, 200 years ago.
It really did take magic, to give France North Africa. The memoirs of Robert Houdin are online. Eric Wiess did not like how Houdin used magic and sleight of hand, to trick the Mullahs and Imams, but that is a Houdini by another name. And someone who was good at escaping gaol.
You hit a sore point, Sorry for the Victorian digression, and history lesson, but those who do not learn from history are ... (Probably delusionly happy.)
-jP |
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 08:38 PM |
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Joined: Jul 10, 2006
Posts: 2655
Location: Minneapolis
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Rather than a service oriented business consider designing and selling a gadget of some sort derived from your expertise with both electronics and software. Perhaps other Freaks can contribute ideas for such a product.
OK, these suggestions may be lame but I'll throw them out anyway. 1) a decent Wifi detector; LEDS indicate the presence of an available network. 2) a simple, small digital clock that wirelessly updates its time once in a while to keep accuracy (using NTP).
Obviously idea #1 is widely available already but the point is all you need to do is design at least as good as the existing and you can sell enough to make a nice living. Idea #2 may not be available (haven't found one yet).
So design a gadget that you can have produced in China for $1, sell to Autozone for $5 who sells it for $15. Sell 20,000 a year for $80K. The key, I think, is to identify a market too small for the big boys but that can sustain a one man operation. (Taking on even one employee changes the game substantially, i.e. quite expensive.)
Perhaps this is a pipe dream, but honestly I don't have the electronics skills for this (yet?) but you do from what I've seen. Once the product is designed and manufactured remotely you pretty much just cash the checks and experiment coming up with the next winner. |
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 09:13 PM |
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Joined: Sep 03, 2004
Posts: 379
Location: Silicon Valley
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cpluscon wrote:
Rather than a service oriented business consider designing and selling a gadget of some sort derived from your expertise with both electronics and software. Perhaps other Freaks can contribute ideas for such a product.
I was getting ready to log off and notice this, Not quite another history lesson, but one from experience as I am making MIDI Gadgets.
First one needs a Business plan. If I knew how to write one I would not be writing this.
Now as for Gagets, Ideas are cheap and three a penny. There are things like distribution networks, Which in the US involve teamsters and othe unions. They like to remind people of protection and product liability.
Most of the gadgets I make have a market in the dozens. Distributed by word of mouth at collector meetings. If I wanted to make 1000s, I could possibly get something together. They the flys arrive as they see the brown stuff. Instead of a company one realizes that they are in the social services and health care business. I am trying to work passed this one.
So one has the next iPod, what then happens is that someone with a factory in China or India or other name your third world wage co. This factory is between jobs, so they run off some sort of lead painted injected molded shiny "Toy" If what you did is simple then they will copy it and as they already have a distribution contract and point of sale space then theirs winds up on the shelf and in the dollar store, and you have excess inventory.
Now I is ingineer. I Make 8515 connect to floppy and play midi songs like an ipod. I make 20 I sell and give away as product advertisement five or six.
Floppy goes obsolete, I replaces floppy with compact flash card I make three, but not in pretty injection molded box. All three sell.
A year or so later someone is advertising in the UK on ebay for similar product using SD card. They say it took 2 years and lots of cost. I email list an say I can produce in US a non RoHS version and sell for one quarter the cost.
Theoretically, according to accountant types, I should charge a lot for the first ones and use that capitol to pay for their mortgage and SUV. This is where I am at. Working hardware, not pretty box and no distribution or product liability graft. While someone sells the same thing on Ebay in a pretty box.
I hear form the UK supplier, who call my offer to do the same thing for 1/4 the cost with more features "Inconceivable, and ill informed."
Advertising does work, however there is a feeling in these so called united states, that if one can not win a lottery, then one can win a lawsuit instead.
I'll expound more on this later in another thread, about why I am learning an old trade as the older people are retiring and the whole field collapsing.
-jP |
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 09:17 PM |
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Joined: Feb 14, 2007
Posts: 1858
Location: San Diego California
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@:-Jim & Carl
No it’s not a pipe dream but a new product often takes much longer to start a revenue stream and require enough capital to mass-produce, market, and pay all the bills for at least six months maybe a year. 10K won’t do this but with a steady source of income it could be done.
IMHO,
John |
_________________
Resistance is futile…… You will be compiled!
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 09:37 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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To those who have posted, thanks for the input - including the private e-mails and PMs.
My mind is working overtime over this. There are many avenues to look down. There may be some good things on the horrizon. I need to take this weekend, thinking about what it is that I want.
There could be an opportunity to teach at a local community college or Votech. I'll have to look into this. There was an offer some years ago but, self-confidence got in the way. But it would be rewarding to teach young adults - especially if it included electronics and AVRs.
I'm also thinking about hustling up some industrial repair contract work. It doesn't take many one day contract jobs at $500.00 to $1,000.00 per day to pay the bills.
I'm seriously considering cleaning up several projects that I have done over the past few years and submitting them to various publishers - bad spelling or not - that's what spell checkers and publishing editors are for.
There are several other good things on the horizon too.
And then there us unemployment. I have only collected unemployment once, after the McDonnell Douglas debacle. I was elegable for 16 weeks but, the state funds at the time only allowed 8 weeks. But anything is better then nothing.
I'll formalize the list over the next few days and see where it leads. |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 09:42 PM |
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Joined: Nov 14, 2001
Posts: 3438
Location: Charlottesville, VA USA
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| Carl, it makes me very sad to hear about your misfortune. I don't know how you feel about using "Temp agencies" but I can report a very positive experience with one. You won't get benefits and you will probably take a pay cut but you will at least have something coming in. In the meantime, hit the street and cold call. I am a firm believer in cold calling because I feel that there are small companies out there that want to find good help but can't for whatever reason. I wish you the best!!! |
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 10:11 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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SteveN wrote:
Carl, it makes me very sad to hear about your misfortune. I don't know how you feel about using "Temp agencies" but I can report a very positive experience with one. You won't get benefits and you will probably take a pay cut but you will at least have something coming in. In the meantime, hit the street and cold call. I am a firm believer in cold calling because I feel that there are small companies out there that want to find good help but can't for whatever reason. I wish you the best!!!
First thing on the list for Monday morning is:
Unemployment office. It's about time I collect some of that benifit that I supposedly had all of these years.
Next, I already have a list of about fifteen local companies that I plan on driving to and personally delevering a resume. It might be expensive but, I have had far better success at personal apearences then mailing or e-mailing resumes.
I will also update Monster.com and CareerBuilder.com. Though, my confidence in them is quite low. Over the past five years or so, I have never gotten a direct contact from any company that I electronically sent a resume to. I have however, gotten many, many phone contact by "Head Hunters" wanting to set me up with some company 4 or 5 states to the west. Yet, I pay the moving expenses. One company even expected me to foot the bill for the plane flight for an interview. NOT!
I've had some offers (again via head hunters) for short term employment. I have been reluctant as, I will have the fact hanging over my head that, it all start over again when the short term employment goes away.
But this time, I'm looking at several methods of income, all supplementing each other. As was said in a phone conversation eariler today: "We can't depend on employers anymore. We can't have the dollar coming in - all from the same place! We need 20 nickle pay checks! That way, if we loose one of those nickle pay checks, we still have 19 nickle pay checks left coming in!" [Undisclosed AVRFreaks member] |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 10:56 PM |
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Joined: Jul 10, 2006
Posts: 2655
Location: Minneapolis
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jporter wrote:
Hopefully you are contacting your creditors
I suspect that if you call your bank and tell them you were layed off they'll likely say, "Oh so sorry to hear that; by the way we aren't going to lend you any more money and your interest rate just went up!"
Might be for the best though. |
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 11:10 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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Actually, if a creditor discovers that you have even been late on a payment - even if it was with a totally different lender - they will up your interest rates. Which doesn't really make sense as, if someone is in a finantial bind, having all the lenders raise their interest rates only compounds the problem. unless, that is, they want you to default. That might make sense with regard to a home load or a big ticket item, such as a automobile. But, with a credit card, they loose big time as, the credit card will be the very last debt that I would consider paying if I were in a finantial bind.
The house payment and car will be the first on the list to be paid - you need a place to live and a car to drive to work.
Next will be the Trailer. If all else fails, we plan on the trailer for our safety net. My wifes income will cover the trailer and Jeep. And the Jeep is fully paid off at the beginning of the year. It is also the oldest vehicle and therefore, probably the least touchable by creditors and bankruptcy.
The rest???
But as I said, the unsecured debt should be considered last, especially if your credit is going to be destroyed anyway...
But this is all hypathetical! Lets see where it is in a week or two. I could get lucky and secure a job Monday morning! You never know, it could happen!!! |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 08, 2007 - 11:55 PM |
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Joined: Sep 04, 2002
Posts: 21271
Location: Orlando Florida
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| If you can invent a gizmo that you can build for $50 and sell for $100 and sell about 1000 a year... 20 a week or so... you could make a living. But if its more or less than that, its a problem. The direct sales model seems best to me, because to get the same $100 into distribution, you'd have to sell it to the wholesaler for $25, who sells it to autozone or whoever for $50, and they sell it for $100. If you have to get $100 in order to live, it makes the retail price $400, and it wont sell. You compete on features and price. So you need a gizmo with completely unique features that the gearheads and early adopters will think is cool. |
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Imagecraft compiler user
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 12:12 AM |
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Joined: Mar 14, 2006
Posts: 909
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Carl,
I suggest you contact contract agencies. You may find temporary work that usually pays very well. You will have to travel a bit but that is the price to be paid.
Check for a private message, I'll send some info.
S.G. |
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 12:14 AM |
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Joined: Jul 10, 2006
Posts: 2655
Location: Minneapolis
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Another lame idea: cigarette lighter or just a holder for such that uses LEDs for decoration or lighting. I bought a lighter at 7-11 with a built in LED and little watch batteries. Make it play a funky tune, whistle if you shake it, meow like a cat....
Perhaps impossible, but it would be highly desirable if your retailers sent you a prepaid order and you then pay your Chinese fab who sends the product directly to your customer. You never see the product, just cash the check. |
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 01:13 AM |
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Joined: Feb 14, 2007
Posts: 1858
Location: San Diego California
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They are all good ideas. With the right marketing you can sell anything; even Pet Rocks!
But without capital suggest he starts quickest source of revenue. Your doing the right thing only consider making and selling gizmos at night. Start with what you have finished like your LCD piggyback board and anything else you have a finished prototype for. Sell the labor you have already spent to learn how to market while your working or building your local business / Job.
You'll find something soon Carl and we all wish you the best,
John |
_________________
Resistance is futile…… You will be compiled!
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 01:50 AM |
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Joined: Jul 10, 2006
Posts: 2655
Location: Minneapolis
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Quote:
But without capital suggest he starts quickest source of revenue.
Quite right John; don't bet the farm on a risky scheme. Make it a spare time project that could become something bigger later on. |
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 02:07 AM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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cpluscon wrote:
Quote:
But without capital suggest he starts quickest source of revenue.
Quite right John; don't bet the farm on a risky scheme. Make it a spare time project that could become something bigger later on.
Thats the plan! Though, there is already something that might generate supplimental income in the works! While this might be starting out small, it could proove to be something quite satisfying in a few months.
Until then, it's beating the doors down during the day and, pounding the keyboard by night!
One other thing...
My middle son, the one in the U.S. Navy, has been kind enough to give me the needed resources to purchase a legal copy of CadSoft Eagle Professional. It will be ordered Monday. This will allow me the ability to more easily share designs and, generally be more in step with the rest of the planet. The really nice thing about Eagle CAD is that, with about a weekend (30 hours) of work, I can make it fully compatable with my Table-Top milling machines. Good news for everyone as, I will be able to take Eagle generated PCB designs and produce single sided PCB for those who might want quick turn-around single sided PCB proto-types.
Oh! And too!!! I am under direct orders of my son that, the money has to be spent on Eagle! Not other household stuff. That takes the money out of the little woman's hands.   |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
Last edited by microcarl on Sep 09, 2007 - 02:19 AM; edited 1 time in total
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 02:14 AM |
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Joined: Mar 28, 2001
Posts: 20387
Location: Sydney, Australia (Gum trees, Koalas and Kangaroos, No Edelweiss)
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After 12.5 years of "busting my guts" (as Carl put it) for my previous employer, designing a product with features that became part of the Australian Standard and have the top selling product of it's type (we used to make them for other manufacturers too under their brand!) it become clear that a BIG change was on it's way with the company being taken over by another and being dismembered. So I quit in February of 1991 and swore to myself that I would NEVER work for another company again, even if it meant I would have to clean toilets to make some money. It has been very hard at times and had to do all kind of electronics work (including TV repairs for a while) but I managed to survive with a family of 4 kids. Now things are a little easier financially, but still need to do long hours frequently...if I can just hang in there for a few more years...it gets harder as you get older getting the work you would like, so becoming your own boss is the only alternative for people 40-50+ it seems.
I wish you all the best Carl, I know how you feel but don't fall apart, something will come up. |
_________________
John Samperi
Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.
www.ampertronics.com.au
* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 02:15 AM |
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Joined: Feb 14, 2007
Posts: 1858
Location: San Diego California
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You can't fail.
Until you give up!
John |
_________________
Resistance is futile…… You will be compiled!
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 02:28 AM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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Hey! You guys are confidence builders. Actually, I think that I can pull something off! It will take time... And yes, I just might have to clean toilets! But thats ok. I'm putting a plan in place to meet the end goal.
I have received many PMs with some good advice and even some links to check out. So, somewhere in all of this, it has to come out for the better. That is the way I'm approaching the whole thing. Time, after time, I've seen what apeared to be bad situations turn into something far better then what was originally in place. We just need to look at the positive side and react to that - not the imediate circumstances.
Long live the AVR!!! |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 04:46 AM |
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Joined: Mar 28, 2001
Posts: 20387
Location: Sydney, Australia (Gum trees, Koalas and Kangaroos, No Edelweiss)
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Quote:
I just might have to clean toilets! But thats ok.
Much better than getting a job programming PICs I hope you realise that you will not be allowed to switch chips in any other new job. |
_________________
John Samperi
Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.
www.ampertronics.com.au
* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 05:27 AM |
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Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Posts: 6702
Location: Bellingham, WA - USA
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Carl, I'm a little late in responding, but I'm really sorry to read about your situation. I saw it early this morning and it's kind of bummed out the whole day. I totally empathize, it being a couple of years since I was fully employed.
If you do end up doing a business for yourself of some kind, and I can be of any kind of help, please don't hesitate to let me know. I can proofread, check or write code, beta test, etc. - and can even sometimes act like I know what I'm doing.
With everyone else I wish you the best of luck. |
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Chuck Baird
"It's better to catch the trapeze than test the safety net" -- RPi book
http://www.cbaird.org
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 12:15 PM |
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Joined: Jun 27, 2005
Posts: 3412
Location: St.Petersburg, Russia
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| Carl, this really sucks. But you'll make it and find a better job or even start a business, there's no doubt about that. I'm feeling for you. |
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 01:16 PM |
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Joined: Aug 19, 2004
Posts: 77
Location: Adelaide South Australia
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Hi Carl,
Sorry to read about your situation. Life sucks at times but it sounds like you have a good family behind you.
I can't offer any advice but the great support you are receiving from other Freaks is impressive (keep it up guys).
Hope your situation improves quickly.
I value your input to the forum and always make it a point to read you technical information which I find very useful.
I'm certain someone out there can use your talents, all you have to do is show them and that's the hard part.
I like the idea about contributing to magazines, way to go to show your abilities.
(there seems to be a very good market for motor speed controllers in the RC/robot field. Most are very over priced for whats involved and with your background I'm sure you could put a HIGH current version with all the little extras for a very marketable price?)
Roy
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73's
Roy
VK5ASY
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 03:38 PM |
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Joined: Jul 02, 2005
Posts: 5946
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Carl,
I too am shocked to learn of the sudden change in your situation and join others in wishing you a speedy return to a predictable income. Did your friend that recommended you for the job also get sacked?
Hang in there. |
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Ross McKenzie
ValuSoft
Melbourne Australia
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 03:49 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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valusoft wrote:
I too am shocked to learn of the sudden change in your situation and join others in wishing you a speedy return to a predictable income.
Thanks!
valusoft wrote:
Did your friend that recommended you for the job also get sacked?
Three of us were hired. My friend was the first. Then there was me and one other guy.
Me and the other guy got sacked on friday. As my friend is in management, he still has some time left but, has been put on notice.
People must not be drinking as much beer this summer as, Miller claims that their sales are down by more then 25%. And, that makes it really bad during the off-season months. |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 04:46 PM |
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Joined: Nov 22, 2002
Posts: 12052
Location: Tangent, OR, USA
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Carl -
I know somewhat your dilemma. Been through that twice in just over a year. First time "restructuring". Second time, startup that ran out of money. Its the pitts.
In my case, I can "retire" which will get us along money-wise. But, I am not ready to hang up the shingle and say bye-bye to what I have spent way too many years learning.
Monster.com is a good job thing, though their recent "problems" makes one wonder; they say that they have privacy issues fixed. The on-line jobs sections from your local and regional newspapers is a good source; far better than the print newspapers. Craig's List (but I've gotten some bummers there). Check the web sites for all the tech companies in your area; they almost always have job postings somewhere (often that are not advertised); they are often buried in the "about us" section or something like that.
Network. Are there other EEs in your area that you can contact to find out who is doing what? Are there any tech orgainizations? In our area, there is a High Tech Forum mostly for startups. They have monthly get-togethers and you can talk to others to find out what is happening.
Cheers and I hope you pull through OK.
Jim |
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 05:34 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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Hi Jim,
Thanks for the input.
I have been active on both Monster.com and CareerBuilder.com for the past several years. I ocassionally get calls from individuals claiming to have gotten my resume from one or the other. The only issue that I have is that, even though I have indicated on those two boards that I'm not willing to move, those individuals are usually only offering employment opportunities that would require me to up-root and move. Well, that isn't practicle for me as, I'd loose my shirt if I sold my house - especially now, with the housing market the way it is. Also, my children and I are very close. Even though all three of my sons are currently in the military, they plan on returning to the area, where they can be close to us. In addition, while I only have a modest house on 2-1/2 acres, for me, this really is God's country. I just spent 2 hours with my wife out on the front deck talking and drinking coffee. The trees are green! The air is filled with the chirping of birds! There's a light breeze! And, there are no sounds of car, trucks and no people dictating how we should conduct ourselves or manage our property. It truely is God's country.
As to the networking thing. The drawback to living in God's country is that, it is 50 miles to any major industrial complex. There is the Ford Transmission plant about 15 minutes away. But they are scheduled to shut down in Janruary, 2008. There are two Cincinnati Milacron facilities about 10 minutes away but, I have submitted several resumes there and have only gotten a "You are over qualified!" I've always read that as meaning "You are over paid!"
I have been dissipointed in one area since I have moved to the Cincinnati area. There aren't any individuals that I can find who are actively into electronics or embedded microcontrollers. There may be some in the Cincinnati proper but, out here in the country, it's mostely country folk commuting to the metropolitan areas to earn a living.
There is an active Amateur Radio community here but, there too, beyond the casual rag chewing, there isn't much going on technically. In fact, I have attempted to have technical discussions on the air and, for each time, the frequency just seemed to go silent shortly after the technical discussion began. So, there isn't much networking one can do from a 50 mile distance of any activity that might be occurring.
This is the price paid for a decision made years ago. When my wife and I left L.A. back in 1979, we vowed that we would never, ever live in the city again. And now we have to live with the consequences of that decision. |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 07:04 PM |
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Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Posts: 6702
Location: Bellingham, WA - USA
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Quote:
And now we have to live with the consequences of that decision.
Instead of saying "have to" I'd say "get to." I also lived in LA, and the reason we're now in Bellingham (a true paradise) rather than Seattle (90 miles away) is because I made the same vow.
Peace of mind and quality of life have no equals. It sounds like you're doing well on the physical and family aspects; it's just that annoying financial thing that is the problem. Since both of your last two jobs included 50+ mile (each way) commutes, I hope your new position, when it reveals itself, is in the neighborhood. |
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Chuck Baird
"It's better to catch the trapeze than test the safety net" -- RPi book
http://www.cbaird.org
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 07:15 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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zbaird wrote:
Since both of your last two jobs included 50+ mile (each way) commutes, I hope your new position, when it reveals itself, is in the neighborhood.
Me too! |
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Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 07:31 PM |
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Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Posts: 6702
Location: Bellingham, WA - USA
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So here's a proposal for you, Carl. Design a breakout board for a smaller AVR with a UART/USART. Put on a few LEDs and switches, a pot, and 2 or 3 servo connections. I'll write it a bootloader that uses the 232 line that is compatible with AVRStudio. It'll be Butterfly Lite with a robotics bent.
Then I'll write a little intro to assembly language (I have a good source I can draw from) that will act as an educational guide. Once it's all done and working you can get some professional boards made. Then you can market these, as kits, for kids (and others) interested in simple robotics and/or learning the basics of embedded systems - robotics clubs, eBay, hobby shops, direct sales, etc. Sell the servos separately - I would think without the servos the parts should be down around $10 or so. We'll stick in a plug for Smiley for those who want to get real and learn C.
Something to think about... |
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Chuck Baird
"It's better to catch the trapeze than test the safety net" -- RPi book
http://www.cbaird.org
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 08:12 PM |
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Joined: Feb 14, 2007
Posts: 1858
Location: San Diego California
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Good advice Chuck. Make and sell everything you can. But focus on revenue first with a job or sub-contract. Then, or at the same time, the quickest source of revenue is to sell what you have and know 1st.
IMHO:
Carl's plan to use Eagle and his milling machine to make and sell boards, cases, etc to Freaks and advertise, I hope in magazines, should derive the quickest self-employment income while preparing him to self-produce gizmos and making projects and writing articles prompting the kits as you suggested should shortly follow.
Focus, write a business plan; I /We all wish to help you succeed.
As soon as you’re ready to produce your next product ask for ideas again. I promise to provide many at that time but don’t get side tracked chasing the next great possible product until you learn how to sell what you know and have now, like milling machine services. Turn all you knowledge, finished prototype boards, and machines into ‘working girls’ first.
John |
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Resistance is futile…… You will be compiled!
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 08:35 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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AllN wrote:
Turn all you knowledge, finished prototype boards, and machines into ‘working girls’ first.
If my product becomes the "Working Girls ", does that mean I'll be a pimp??? |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 09:09 PM |
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Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Posts: 6702
Location: Bellingham, WA - USA
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| You can be Gung Ho about your projects. |
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Chuck Baird
"It's better to catch the trapeze than test the safety net" -- RPi book
http://www.cbaird.org
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Posted: Sep 09, 2007 - 09:11 PM |
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Joined: Feb 14, 2007
Posts: 1858
Location: San Diego California
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Sorry but; YES YOU ARE CORRECT, SIR!!!!
The better the pimp the richer you are.
The hard truth:
Choices are limited; you either have to expolite something, somebody, or yourself, or learn how and have the money to market even Pet Rocks!
John
Edited:
PS:
Remember you can sell anything, even if the price is FREE . . . plus $15.00 shipping and handling!! |
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Resistance is futile…… You will be compiled!
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Posted: Sep 10, 2007 - 01:40 AM |
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Joined: Nov 17, 2004
Posts: 13847
Location: Vancouver, BC
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I'm very sorry to hear this too. I've been there a couple of times myself, but it has always worked out. Been there with the credit card thing as well, certainly not fun. But I wouldn't throw them out just yet. Refrain from using them, but keep at least one for real emergencies.
I would find something small and cheap to make, but marketable. Christmas is just around the corner, so maybe a tree ornament with a tri-color LED changing colors or blinking. And sell them with low overhead such as flea markets or ebay. |
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Regards,
Steve A.
The Board helps those that help themselves.
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Posted: Sep 10, 2007 - 11:05 PM |
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Joined: Nov 03, 2006
Posts: 45
Location: Virginia, USA
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Carl,
I'm am very sorry to hear of your misfortune. The effort that you have shown helping others here at AVRfreaks has been an inspiration to me. I know that you will pull through, although it might not be an easy road.
If you decide to go the consulting or on-call repair business route, I would suggest you put together a "brag" book of projects you have worked on. One project per page, with the problem you solved, the technologies used (AVR, PLC, etc), and some pretty pictures. I think we engineers tend to dismiss pictures as just marketing, but they are a great hook to get people interested. Having the brag book gives you a concrete example beyond just showing your resume. Heck, bring some personal projects with you to demonstrate your ability.
If you go the kit route, make sure to have a look at ladyada's site. There is a great page describing her process for putting together a kit that might save you a few pitfalls:
http://www.ladyada.net/make/mintyboost/process.html
Best of luck to you! |
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Posted: Sep 11, 2007 - 01:22 AM |
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Joined: Sep 11, 2006
Posts: 163
Location: Kamuela, HI
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Carl, it's with a heavy heart that I read all this. I do think you'll turn this into something good, but it doesn't make the moment any easier to live.
On using Eagle and your CNC mill: Absolutely you can do this. There's an Eagle plug-in for TurboCNC that works quite well, both for trace routing and drilling. I used to know where it lived, but I lost that link a while back. If it's still there, it's not a bad starting point for what you're talking about.
On selling your own inventions: I'll be curious to hear how this works out. Several years ago a friend and I tossed that idea around. I kept coming up with ideas that were practical (meaning "useful" and "a global distribution of 250 units, tops"), and finally he straightened me out: Practical inventions are rarely big sellers. In his words, "You have to invent something dumb like an exhaust tip with LEDs in it or something!" Two weeks later we saw the first LED exhaust tip in a magazine ad. I laughed, but he was right. I still come up with practical ideas and have nothing to market.
The teaching gig can work well, but it's tough to find places that'll pay. One possibility, if you have the stomach for it: A lot of schools are getting into robotic competitions. Private schools may be interested in hiring you as a technology teacher with a bent toward coaching a FIRST robotics team or some such. The robotics stuff probably wouldn't even make you break a sweat, but working with high school kids might. Still, you have four grown kids? My guess is you'd be fine.
On doing CNC milling work on contract, Digital Machinist ran a couple of good articles on business models for small machine shops. Worth taking a look at, though the first one is apparently from an issue that's no longer stocked (I tried.)
And absolutely positively I agree that you should hang on to your books and tools, come what may. It was partly based on my hobbies that I got my current job. Without the mill and lathe sitting in my shop, I doubt I'd have landed it. (I didn't get into AVRs until later.)
Hang in there.
Tom |
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Posted: Sep 11, 2007 - 01:40 AM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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35pixels wrote:
I'm am very sorry to hear of your misfortune.
Actually, I am not looking at this as a misfortune... I'm actually looking at this as a God-send!
I am concerned about my imediate future, as I probably should be. But I also believe that something for the better will come out of this, as times like these have always gotten better, in the end.
35pixels wrote:
The effort that you have shown helping others here at AVRfreaks has been an inspiration to me.
Thank you for the kind words. Look, I am fully aware that I can be, and have been, a "Pompus Ass!" But that is out of frustration with the competence displayed many times with regard to learning and, who's responsibility our individual learning falls on.
But, beyond the frustration and the frequent display of "Anal Retentive" tendencies’, I have this need to share what I know with others. It's not that I want to brag about what I know... It's more that I came by what I have learned over the years with such difficulty that, I want to share that knowledge, hoping to save others the mistakes and failures (a point of perstecive here) that I have endured. But even the failures turned into successes because, I pushed forward and learned from those preceived failures. If the forum members haven't taken notice, I'm as addicted to AVRFreaks as the guy using Crack-Cocane. It's sad, isn't it? But, it's legal and socially acceptable!
35pixels wrote:
If you decide to go the consulting or on-call repair business route, I would suggest you put together a "brag" book of projects you have worked on. One project per page, with the problem you solved, the technologies used (AVR, PLC, etc), and some pretty pictures. I think we engineers tend to dismiss pictures as just marketing, but they are a great hook to get people interested. Having the brag book gives you a concrete example beyond just showing your resume. Heck, bring some personal projects with you to demonstrate your ability.
Actually, I keep an enginnering notebook on each project that I have ever done. At the end of the project, I make a report style manual, documenting the entire project. You've seen this style if you've visited the projects section and view/used the "My_LCD Serial Backpack" project that I contributed to the AVRFreaks community.
When I go for an interview, I usually bring a couple of my project reports with me as a "Marketing/Selling" strategy. Sometimes the interviewer is impressed, somethes he/she is not. The one that really seems to trigger their interest is the physical hardware that the project notbook represents. I've had good success at this, when the opportunity presents itself.
On another note:
I have purchased a license to upgrade my evaluation copy of Mach3 for my table-top milling machines, removing the 500 lines of G-CODE limitation. This will allow me to drill and mill much larger proto-type printed circuit boards, as well as make small (5" x 9") custom control panels and project boxes. It will also provide more functionality, allowing the ability to manufacturer small parts for the hobby robotics sector.
The really big news is that, today I placed an order for CadSoft Eagle Professional. This not only makes me compatable with the larger part of the AVRFreaks community members, it opens the door to more easily produce professionally made PCBs. We all know what that means... Expect a flury of new, useful projects aimed at the Servo controls, LCD display adapters, small projects pertenent to instrumentation, the Dragon, the STK500, the AVR family of microcontrollers and, the STK600 when it finally arrives.
The funds for the Mach3 license and legal copy of CadSoft Eagle Professional software are the gift of one of my children. While only using about $1,100.00 for the two purchases, my son has offered a total of $10,000.00 to aid in moving the business aspects of this whole thing forward. That at least gives me some working capital to get things moving, at least on a small scale.
These things will not, in themselves support my imediate monetary needs! But they will eventually supplement what ever income I end up with when the next employment opportunity presents itself.
So, I have to once again thank the many, many AVRFreaks who have shown their support and concern regading my current employment situation.
Yes, this could be viewed as a bad situation or, even a disaster. But in reality, it will turn into what ever I make of it! There will be bumps in the road along the way but, I have control of the vehicle taking me along this path. And, I have the knowledge, drive, determination and skills to eventually put this vehicle exactly where I want it - financial independence! |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 11, 2007 - 03:32 AM |
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Joined: May 24, 2003
Posts: 91
Location: Chanute, Kansas, USA
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Hi Carl,
I would like to pass on my story of being laid off:
About a year and half ago, I was laid off for “financial reasons” after 6.5 years of employment. There were about 4 other engineers caught in the same layoff. (about 15 engineers in the company.) The area I live in has a city with a population of 10K every 20 or 30 miles. So, it’s definitely not a hotbed of embedded design. After the layoff, I went back to the company the next week for a few hours (as a consultant) and showed one of the remaining engineers how to use AVR tools, since most of the projects I did there was with an AVR. (No one else there used Atmel micro’s)
Cutting to the end: I had 4 interviews after the layoff within an hour’s drive of my apartment. Two I found on the states (Kansas) available jobs web site. One was through a salesman that knew of an open position in a neighboring town. (The engineer that I “trained” on the AVR passed on the information.) The final interview I found by driving through industrial parks in neighboring towns. (I wrote down the names of businesses and then looked them up on the internet to see if they did any embedded work) Three weeks after the layoff, the job I ended up taking was an interesting one: the majority of their embedded products use AVR’s!
Interesting note: 5 months and 7 days after I was laid off, I was offered my previous position. I turned them down, ‘cause I like where I work at now better. 
It was very stressful at the time, but I’m better off now.
Keep up a positive attitude, it helps!
Good luck,
Matt M. |
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Posted: Sep 12, 2007 - 02:41 PM |
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Joined: Jan 08, 2004
Posts: 373
Location: Westborough, MA (USA)
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Oddly, I was let go the Friday before September 11, 2001.
You are correct in that this will lead to something better. It always does (and this is coming from someone who has been laid off / fired 4 times in 10 years).
Here's what I would do: Update the resume, make contacts, interview as much as possible, and call the recruiters.
Meanwhile... have fun! Do some odd job that you wouldn't normally get time to do. I delivered pizzas and taught CPR/First Aid to make ends meet. Maybe I'd be a bar tender the next time around.
This happens to all of us. You'll make it through. We all do.
Regards,
Paul |
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Posted: Sep 12, 2007 - 10:51 PM |
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Joined: Mar 28, 2001
Posts: 20387
Location: Sydney, Australia (Gum trees, Koalas and Kangaroos, No Edelweiss)
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Quote:
Maybe I'd be a bar tender the next time around.
Carl would scare off the clients, I don't think he is the kind of person that would take any nonsense from people and "lend them his ears". He would tell them to wake up to themselves and deal with their problems instead of getting drunk. The bar would go broke
In one of my earliest attempts at being self employed (30+years ago) I did food home deliveries for shops during my TV/Radio/anything fixing runs. At times things would take a little longer at fixing and the ice cream would melt, don't think anyone died of food poisoning |
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John Samperi
Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.
www.ampertronics.com.au
* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly
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Posted: Sep 12, 2007 - 11:29 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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js wrote:
Quote:
Maybe I'd be a bar tender the next time around.
Carl would scare off the clients, I don't think he is the kind of person that would take any nonsense from people and "lend them his ears". He would tell them to wake up to themselves and deal with their problems instead of getting drunk. The bar would go broke
Actually, coming from a very wasteful younger life of ingesting any substance that would put me in an altered state of mind (read Off-Topic posts of about 2004), I'd probably give some counsel to stop running away from reality and, yes, face his/her problems head-on.
But I don't think any form of abuse counceling from behind a bar counter would be very convincing. I mean, "Heres a drink, now stop drinking! " isn't going to be very productive toward helping anyone straighten out their lives.
Yeah, you right John, I'd probably not serve their request and send them on their miserable way. |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 13, 2007 - 03:56 PM |
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Joined: Jan 03, 2006
Posts: 304
Location: Wisconsin, USA
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Quote:
Yeah, you right John, I'd probably not serve their request and send them on their miserable way.
Kinda reminds me of a good tune by Kenny Chesney, "The Good Stuff" You can search the lyrics if you've never heard it.
Carl, I'm bummed to hear about the changes. Quite the roller coaster ride. And from what you've said you have a good mate that doesn't seem to mind taking the ride with you. That's the main thing. Sounds like you've got great kids too.
On the flip side Carl, I spent a couple of hours last night in one of my silos with a pressure washer blowing a 1/4" of pigeon crap off the unloader so I can grease and go through it with out getting deathly ill from all the nasties that pigeons carry with them. It's time to chop corn. So if you need a job you can come on up and I'll be glad to put ya to work. The pay is for the birds but you'd have a job, if you're sure that's what you want.
Seriously though, we're wishing you the best in your changes. And if you might need anything from up my way always feel free to PM me and we'll talk.
Sincerely,
Ben Nemec |
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Posted: Sep 13, 2007 - 04:59 PM |
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Joined: Nov 17, 2004
Posts: 13847
Location: Vancouver, BC
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Quote:
Maybe I'd be a bar tender the next time around.
Somehow I think Carl looks more like a taxi driver |
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Regards,
Steve A.
The Board helps those that help themselves.
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Posted: Sep 13, 2007 - 05:16 PM |
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Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Posts: 6702
Location: Bellingham, WA - USA
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| Carl, isn't this where you say "You talkin' to me?" |
_________________
Chuck Baird
"It's better to catch the trapeze than test the safety net" -- RPi book
http://www.cbaird.org
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Posted: Sep 13, 2007 - 06:18 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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Koshchi wrote:
Quote:
Maybe I'd be a bar tender the next time around.
Somehow I think Carl looks more like a taxi driver
zbaird wrote:
Carl, isn't this where you say "You talkin' to me?"
Hey! You talkin' to me???
Taxie driver? I can hardly find my way to Conconnati, how would that work - not knowing my way around. Besides, with my luck, I'd probably get robbed, or something. Ok, ok, "Or something" - don't go there, please!!!  |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 16, 2007 - 09:49 PM |
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Joined: Jul 24, 2006
Posts: 1300
Location: Missouri
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Carl,
I also am sorry to read of your current predicament. I am also sorry that today I do not have time to read through all four pages on this thread (and forgive me if this has been posted already) but, I thought rather than philosophize over the "state of the union" I would toss out some possible options. The first thing that comes to mind is a teaching position at a technical school, high school or technical class at a Junior College. Although the pay may be less than your past jobs, teaching can be profoundly rewarding in other ways and lead to contacts that can be future jobs. Also, taking a teaching position for less than your career salary rarely impacts your earning potential in your past/future field (for various reasons which I will not go into).
Next, instead of blasting Uncle Sammy, look first to what your past company offers regarding outgoing job placement assistance (most large companies have "displaced worker counselors" that may help somewhat). AND Uncle Sammy is dying to give you a small business loan to open....ANYTHING you want but, do it now! Ever wanted to open a store or business of some kind? Go to Uncle Sammy and ask for some money to do just that.
Third, look to new friends and old. My father was able to give an old friend (a typesetter by trade) a very nice paying job as a custodian (I know it sounds stupid but this was no ordinary custodian job) with full medical and a pension plan after computers put his old company under. Look to your old and new friends and flat out ASK them for a job. Some may be able to help. This kind of story pains me and I certainly would help if there was any way at all I could.
Fourth, keep your head up! Remember, stay UP UP UP if you can. Good karma begets good karma!! So try to continually look for the positive.
Sorry I have to go now but...will read all four pages later.
John |
_________________
You may only be one person in the world but, you may be the world to one person!
"Life! Life, do you hear me? Give my creation LIFE!" Gene Wilder
SKYPE Name: JonRobrt
Last edited by johnrk on Sep 17, 2007 - 03:42 AM; edited 1 time in total
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Posted: Sep 16, 2007 - 10:51 PM |
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Joined: Nov 17, 2004
Posts: 13847
Location: Vancouver, BC
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Quote:
Taxie driver? I can hardly find my way to Conconnati, how would that work - not knowing my way around.
I said that you looked like a taxi driver, I didn't say you would be a good one! |
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Regards,
Steve A.
The Board helps those that help themselves.
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Posted: Sep 17, 2007 - 05:34 PM |
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Joined: Apr 27, 2007
Posts: 136
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Best of luck Carl! My advice:
Don't max out those credit cards or you'll dig yourself into a hole that may be too deep to ever get out of.
Consider designing and manufacturing your own product, but only if you can come up with a good idea. I suggest you avoid selling to other hobbyists because (and sorry for this but it's true) hobbyists are notoriously cheap about spending money. They will invest $1,000 worth of time to save $50 of expense. Hams too, and I've been a ham for 45 years. Look for an idea that the general public might buy, and then sell it on an eBay or Amazon store you create.
If you're any good with PCs you might start a PC repair and tutoring business. (I'm going to do this in a few years when I retire, for mad money.) Hobbyists and small businesses would be your customers, and with everybody having a PC there are plenty of them.
Again, good luck!
Greg |
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Posted: Sep 17, 2007 - 08:40 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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GregoryC wrote:
...hobbyists are notoriously cheap about spending money. They will invest $1,000 worth of time to save $50 of expense.
Isn't that the absloute truth! |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 17, 2007 - 08:56 PM |
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Joined: Nov 23, 2005
Posts: 27
Location: Seinäjoki, Finland
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Sorry to hear about your situation!
You'll just have to design your own "NOKIA" Thats all...
Good luck anyways! |
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SW Design Engineer
Finland
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 12:33 AM |
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Joined: Mar 28, 2001
Posts: 20387
Location: Sydney, Australia (Gum trees, Koalas and Kangaroos, No Edelweiss)
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Quote:
You'll just have to design your own "NOKIA"
but it will have to be that good that it will "NOKIA your socks off" been dying to use it |
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John Samperi
Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.
www.ampertronics.com.au
* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 03:13 PM |
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Joined: Nov 23, 2005
Posts: 27
Location: Seinäjoki, Finland
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Nice expression! I'd say! |
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SW Design Engineer
Finland
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 04:05 PM |
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Joined: Feb 19, 2001
Posts: 25921
Location: Wisconsin USA
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Quote:
js wrote:
Quote:
Maybe I'd be a bar tender the next time around.
Carl would scare off the clients, ...
Bouncer? |
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 05:50 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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theusch wrote:
Quote:
js wrote:
Quote:
Maybe I'd be a bar tender the next time around.
Carl would scare off the clients, ...
Bouncer?
Na! While I am a "Pompus Old Fart ", I am a weenie in real life. My wife, who is 5'2", and an ex-marine, can take me. So, I just wouldn't make a very good bouncer.
My goal in life is to be a Wal-Mart greeter. That way, I can flurt with all of the sweet little old ladies - and the cute young one's too! |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 05:56 PM |
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Joined: Apr 27, 2007
Posts: 136
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 06:13 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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GregoryC wrote:
The word is 'pompous.'
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/pompous
Spell it wrong again and I'm going to have to hurt you.
Well, maybe when the Atmel boys get the new web-site up and running, it'll have an on-line spell-checker too.
Until then, I'll rely on you for my spell-checking.
And, if you mess with me, I'll have to turn my wife loose on you! |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 07:17 PM |
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Joined: Feb 14, 2007
Posts: 1858
Location: San Diego California
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Oh No, not the wife!!!!
Anything but that!
Cheers,
John |
_________________
Resistance is futile…… You will be compiled!
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 07:43 PM |
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Joined: May 24, 2004
Posts: 5996
Location: Tampere, Finland
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When I first saw your post, I thought that could happen to me too. And now it did.
I'd better read earlier posts too, just to gather some ideas what to do now - but I think I will spend some time off home with my kid, and graduate One good thing about social security is, despite of high taxes, that being a house dad gets you 70% of income what you have earned at work.
- Jani |
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 07:54 PM |
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Joined: Feb 14, 2007
Posts: 1858
Location: San Diego California
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Jepael wrote:
When I first saw your post, I thought that could happen to me too. And now it did.
I'd better read earlier posts too, just to gather some ideas what to do now - but I think I will spend some time off home with my kid, and graduate One good thing about social security is, despite of high taxes, that being a house dad gets you 70% of income what you have earned at work.
- Jani
But at least you have a safety net and to get paid to watch the kids and go to school!! Wow!
I wish you only the best,
John
PS:
Why does anyone work? 70% of your income and a few side jobs would equal more than your salary now? I'd just stay home and play with the kids!!! |
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Resistance is futile…… You will be compiled!
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 08:05 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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Jepael wrote:
When I first saw your post, I thought that could happen to me too. And now it did.
Sorry for your mis-fortune! I can relate to the gut-sinking feeling.
Jepael wrote:
One good thing about social security is, despite of high taxes, that being a house dad gets you 70% of income what you have earned at work.
Not here in the U.S. We can't even get close to Social Security until the age of 62, unless there is some hardship (not loosing your job) that over rides the age limit.
I applied for un-employment last week. I still haven't heard whether or not I'll get it. Yet, I'm required to comply with all of the idiodic rules that come with the application.
I received a letter yeasterday about an employment opportunity that might possibly match my qualifications. Looking up the job listing on the unemployment web-page showed that the job only paid $10.00 per hour, less then a third of my normal wages.
Being compelled by the unemployment office to respond to their job match notifications, I called them and talked with them about this job listing. As this prospect is unable to support my financial requirements, they (the unemployment office) simply marked that employment opportunity as unsuitable.
I now have about 50 resumes out there - each with a custom taylored cover letter. No responses, to date.
It could be a long Fall/Winter season. |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 08:08 PM |
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Joined: Oct 30, 2002
Posts: 5720
Location: The Netherlands
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Quote:
Why does anyone work? 70% of your income and a few side jobs would equal more than your salary now? I'd just stay home and play with the kids!!!
In Holland we have the same kind of social security, but hey, it doesn't come for free 
Here you have to do at least one job application per week, and after a few months you've to accept every job, even if it's toilet cleaning. And it's only for a limited time, depending on how long you've worked before. One month per year iirc. After that you fall back to normal social security of which you can only survive really. And if you own a house, you've got to sell it, and use the money to eat before you can use the social security |
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 08:26 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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I think here, if I'm approaved, I'll get about 16 weeks at something like $150.00 per week. About 3.5% of my normal income.
The housing marked right now is way down so, I doubt I'll be able to sell it. More then likely, if I can't make the mortage payment, I'll lose it.
But, there is some time before that would happen.
And if it does, I have a safety net in place.
If I do end up losing the house, I have the 35 foot travel trailor. I'll set it up along side of my daughters home. We've (my wife and I) have already lived in it for more then a year, back when all of the kids still lived at home.
And then too, maybe I'll just move where all the real jobs are like California, Arizona, Texas, Washington state, Oregon, etc...
Hey, zbaird, what are the job prospects like up there in Washington state??? My oldest son is stationed at Ft. Lewis. I have been to Washington state only once (for about 24 hours), while I was on a service call. It was absolutely gorgeous! |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 08:29 PM |
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Joined: Oct 30, 2002
Posts: 5720
Location: The Netherlands
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| Move to Silicon Valley and get a job at Atmel. Maybe you can access the Dragon schematic then |
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 08:34 PM |
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Joined: Dec 17, 2005
Posts: 1498
Location: Europe- Estonia- Tallinn
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hehe... We Estonians tend to joke about, that an unemployed Fin (Finnish guy) gets better "pay" than some of our employed people. Don't you get 1 free newspaper, Free TV, smaller taxes etc?
Sad to hear, that you lost your job though, both you, Jani, and you Carl. I know it's devastating for you Americans as your whole life depends on it (as you have mentioned). That's the only reason I'm happy with higher taxes. I know, that if something like this happens, our government will try to keep me alive (at least for some time).
Cheers and keep your heads up,
Rain |
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 08:42 PM |
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Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Posts: 6702
Location: Bellingham, WA - USA
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Quote:
Hey, zbaird, what are the job prospects like up there in Washington state?
If you're in Seattle, they're great. If you're in Bellingham, they're so bad you'll starve (if you're a techie). People commute from here into Microsoft, about 90 miles, but I choose to starve rather than spend most of my life on I5. I've had steady work about 4 of the last 9 years.
But it is beautiful. East of the Cascades it gets a little nasty weather-wise, as Tom will surely tell you. |
_________________
Chuck Baird
"It's better to catch the trapeze than test the safety net" -- RPi book
http://www.cbaird.org
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 08:51 PM |
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Joined: May 24, 2004
Posts: 5996
Location: Tampere, Finland
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AllN wrote:
PS:
Why does anyone work? 70% of your income and a few side jobs would equal more than your salary now? I'd just stay home and play with the kids!!!
Heh, well you are not allowed to do any side work if you take care of the kids full-time, and the parenthood benefit period is about 6 months for the dad or something. I have studied for so long that I have not received any student benefit for three years now, so in this event I am not regarded as a student by the social security, so this is why I can just write the stupid thesis and receive money based on my salary. But while I still am enrolled at a university, the union unemployment benefit board regards me as a student, so I can't get unemployment benefit from the union (there are exceptions), so I could only get government unemployment benefit, except that when taking care of the kids at home, I am not regarded as unemployed, and therefore get the parenthood benefit.
But in real life if one is a student without regular income and receives student benefit, well, it's either the very low student benefit or the minimum parenthood benefit, but you can't have both. I think the minimum parenthood benefit is more than student benefit, but I am not sure if one is allowed to study when receiving parenthood benefit. It's kind of complicated, and I have to figure all this out anyway in few days.
Too bad the notice period for me is only 1 month, because I have worked less than 4 years in this firm. If I had 2 months, I could easily take it easy for 1 month before applying for the parenthood benefit.
- Jani |
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 08:52 PM |
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Joined: Apr 27, 2007
Posts: 136
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microcarl wrote:
And, if you mess with me, I'll have to turn my wife loose on you!
Okay, you win! I'll stand down... |
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 09:29 PM |
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Joined: May 24, 2004
Posts: 5996
Location: Tampere, Finland
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bloody-orc wrote:
hehe... We Estonians tend to joke about, that an unemployed Fin (Finnish guy) gets better "pay" than some of our employed people. Don't you get 1 free newspaper, Free TV, smaller taxes etc?
In a way you are correct. A newspaper or TV fee are considered somewhat as basic rights. Perhaps a phone too - but I am not sure about cell phones. Hard to get land lines these days, but a phone is required so that the unemployment officials can call you and give you work the instant they have something.
But you seriously need to work on that get so unemployed, you really have to show there has been no money for a long time in your bank account or other savings or that you don't own a car or a apartment etc.. It's not glorious, but I once saw a documentary about a guy who just thought that the "rat race" is not for him - he likes things simple. So TV, newspaper, phone, very small apartment where he lives alone, and some coupons to get food every week. No money to spend on anything, but he didn't want to anyway.
- Jani
Edit: oh and it is better to be unemployed than a student, you get more money that way. Some students who don't study hard enough cannot get student money, but then they are eligible for basic support money which is more than student money, but then you cannot be unemployed because you study.
And if you happen to be unemployed, it is better to stay unemployed, because if you work every now and then, the earned money plus unemployment money is less than the full unemployment money. |
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Posted: Sep 18, 2007 - 11:29 PM |
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Joined: Feb 14, 2007
Posts: 1858
Location: San Diego California
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@:-Jani Thanks for the info!!!
Maybe this info could help someone?
Here’s a step-by-step for starting a business that anyone with your knowledge could do and earn $10,000 per month; Or if I knew what you guys knew:
You guys like electronic and programming, right. You just need to learn how to market these services to the highest bidder. How? Here is one way.
Kids like robots, parents like kids to learn subjects that teach a possible vocation.
So we need to come up with the cheapest advertisement scheme that teach the parents they need your new on-line “Learning Method” to trick their kids into learning a vocation while appealing to the children to ask there parents for the cool kits you’re selling.
The service you’re selling is on-line video class and tutor service in any subject you like. The service is really just assuring they can have a running device at the end of their tutoring. You charge way too much to rich kids only (sorry) as it is easier to sell 100 rich parents at a $100.00 a month, to earn $10k per month, as it is to sell and service 1000 kids at $10.00 per month.
This is what most folks miss. Only market your services for the highest price per hour same as the experts in the field. It reduces the areas to advertise in to those that can truly afford to pay you way too much. Actually try and become the highest paid person in your field. But live up to the pay with the service and value you actually provide to the client. Actually take the time for them to learn something.
Here are the basic steps required:
1)Don’t listen to all the nay sayer! Everyone will tell you why it’s a bad idea has too much competition, you can’t do that because! Once you have done it these same people will tell you I knew it was a good idea and I knew you could do it. I will tell you this: If you do the work and the marketing and don’t quit. It’s hard to completely fail!!!
2)Think of a business name
3)File a ‘Fictitious Business Name’ form with your local county recorder (usually) many are on-line and most states required it to be advertised in the local paper for some period of time 2-days to 1 week normally.
4)Take the 'Fictitious Business Name form' to your local bank and open a bank account under that name with $50.00
5)Go to your local city office and pay from $15.00 - $225.00 (average $30.00) for a ‘business license’. Required even for an office in your home!
6)Setup you’re website, exchange links with every electronic and kid site you can find no matter the subject!!!!
7)Go to your local State ‘Sale Tax’ office and get a ‘resale license’. This will allow you to buy wholesale and resale kits, parts, etc. In California it’s the State Board of Equalization. (If you tell them you’re are going to sell thousands that is what the deposit will be based on. So tell them most of the income is non-taxable labor and the resale of kits is very small maybe 1 or 2 hundred per month. This answer should require no deposit in most states.)
8)Send a letter to the product manufactures you would like to sell. This could be robots kits from Lego’s adding AVR’s and or sensors or any electronic kit a kid would like to play with. Explain your companies services and that you are evaluating their product for resale and request an evaluation kit that you would be willing to return. (Those that send them don’t ask for them back)
9)Select the kit(s).
10)Write the code and or build the circuits required to add value to the kit and this is you’re curriculum.
11)Marketing:
a)Press releases “New learning method” with a Web-link in ‘every’ paper in the world! If you speak more than one language even better double your market! Marketing is about the hype, and sorry you’re going to have to spam and learn to like it. (Remember to only announce one kit at a time even if you start with 50 kits you intend to support. First pick the kit you feel will always be the best seller. You should be able to tell this based on which manufacture is selling the most!
b)Many clubs and music schools etc have bulletin boards either on-line or physical post your services world wide here too.
c)Direct mail cost money but is effective. Find the highest priced real estate in every city in the world market there first. Rule of thumb for over priced services are 1000 letters = 1 sale!
1)Two different letters are required, one to the parent one to the child.
Example:
Does you’re child or grandchild’s grades show you they are bored at school and missing their opportunity to a better future! Do they seem to want to only play with computers and toys? If you’re concerned about their future vocation then you really need to keep reading, as there is a solution to get them to want to learn. We at “Creative Learning” (Use your Co name) have discovered so many brilliant kids are bored and not participating in the classroom yet excel when exposed to the same subjects masked as building a project or toy.
We take a different approach to learning. Instead of saying here you need to learn this in order to do cool things in the future. We say here is a cool robot kit and you’re going to need to learn math, electronic, programming, map making, and many other subjects in order to build and play with it. Suddenly your child understands why they need to know so many different subjects and why they need English to write because we correspond by email and we point out spelling and grammar mistakes.
Sorry, but we can only tutor a limited number of children as our capacity is limited by undivided attention so fill out our attached application today or better yet visit our website at: http://www.XYZ.com/apps.asm
Hoping to help your child succeed in life,
Your name here
This is off the top of my head but with a little rewrite this could make many people 10K a month without much work once it's running.
Hope this helps,
John
<edited>
Get the name and address of the parents/ grandparents from the property tax records. Usually the county recorder, again it's on-line and you can buy these lists and many student mailing lists too, thou not sure if students are sorted by zip code. |
_________________
Resistance is futile…… You will be compiled!
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Posted: Sep 19, 2007 - 05:55 PM |
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Joined: Apr 27, 2007
Posts: 136
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Well the unemployment disease seems to be contagious. This being my last week before taking vacation, I've been told that it's been decided to not proceed on my phase of my project at this time (USB for AP7 based product), and there are no other projects at this time. I'm a consultant, i.e. self employed, so I'm without a customer and thus without work (and more importantly, without income). Well I'll take my vacation camping in southwest Utah and northern Arizona (north rim of the Grand Canyon) for a few weeks, and then return to who knows what?
One bit of advice for consultants: You are not financially prepared for a life as a consultant unless you have saved up enough money to cover a full year of expenses. I've followed my own advice religiously, so happily, my lifestyle will not change any time in the near future, and I have a full year to find a new job.
I'll continue dropping in to AVR Freaks and might even start a hobby project, but of course I'll find one that could become a product and generate a little income.
Does misery love company? |
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Posted: Sep 19, 2007 - 06:34 PM |
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Joined: Feb 14, 2007
Posts: 1858
Location: San Diego California
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I forgot perhaps the most important thing:
How to FINANCE your business when you have no money!
Gees, how could I forget to tell you how to live while you're starting your new business. Even the poor can get a government-backed loan from the SBA’s loan guarantee programs SCORE can help you here.
1) You rewrite the business outline above into ‘your’ business plan.
2) Call and visit your local SCORE = Free online and face to face business counseling, mentoring, and training by retired business men and women who have been there and done that! http://www.score.org/findscore/chapter_maps.html
3) They will help you get a SMALL BUSINESS LOAN backed by the government to start most new business.
The Cost and terms:
Interest: 7-9%
Terms: 7-20 years
Amount: $50,000 - $1,000,000
Longest payback for other than real estate loan
It can be a complex process but SCORE will help you struggle through to receive form 50K to 1 Million. It's worth the struggle!!!
You can pay yourself a good wage too out of this 50+K!!
If you need any business advice PM me. I would be happy to help make you rich! Then I can ask you for a loan next year!!
Best of success,
John
<edited>
If you're out of work start this process today as it can take 60 days or more.
Do something today and everyday!!!!!! |
_________________
Resistance is futile…… You will be compiled!
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Posted: Sep 21, 2007 - 11:38 PM |
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Joined: Jul 24, 2006
Posts: 1300
Location: Missouri
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Carl wrote:
Quote:
And if it does, I have a safety net in place.
If I do end up losing the house, I have the 35 foot travel trailor. I'll set it up along side of my daughters home. We've (my wife and I) have already lived in it for more then a year, back when all of the kids still lived at home.
WHAAAAATTT?? Are you kidding? I say we could all come together and cough up the doe for a payment until that dream job comes through. I would be willing to donate!!
We could probably do one month anyway and that would buy four more weeks!!
John |
_________________
You may only be one person in the world but, you may be the world to one person!
"Life! Life, do you hear me? Give my creation LIFE!" Gene Wilder
SKYPE Name: JonRobrt
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Posted: Sep 21, 2007 - 11:50 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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johnrk wrote:
Carl wrote:
Quote:
And if it does, I have a safety net in place.
If I do end up losing the house, I have the 35 foot travel trailer. I'll set it up along side of my daughters home. We've (my wife and I) have already lived in it for more then a year, back when all of the kids still lived at home.
WHAAAAATTT?? Are you kidding? I say we could all come together and cough up the doe for a payment until that dream job comes through. I would be willing to donate!!
We could probably do one month anyway and that would buy four more weeks!!
John
I'm humbled!
That someone here would even think about going that far tells me a lot about many of the individuals within the AVRFreaks community.
Thank you for the offer. It's two full weeks now. I've sent at least 150 resumes out via the Internet and, I even knocked on a few doors. Not even one response - via e-mail or telephone.
But, I do have the offer of some lite programming work, when everything is finally in place.
Also, today I talked to someone in England who wants an RS-232 data logger made. The exact specifications are yet to come.
Again, thank you so much, even for just thinking about something like you've suggested. |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 21, 2007 - 11:58 PM |
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Joined: Oct 30, 2002
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Quote:
Also, today I talked to someone in England who wants a RS-232 data logger made. The exact specifications are yet to come.
Oh oh... I recall such kind of application from a guy who had all kinds of small jobs but no time to do them and wanted to outsource them. I believe he posted a job ad in Jack Ganssle's Embedded Muse mailing list; that's where I got his address from IIRC.
This is RS232 data logger is some kind of test, when you ask for exact specifications he suddenly has no time or something like that. Is been a while ago so can't recall the details. Anyway, it turned out to be something weird and bogus  |
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Posted: Sep 22, 2007 - 12:04 AM |
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jayjay1974 wrote:
Quote:
Also, today I talked to someone in England who wants a RS-232 data logger made. The exact specifications are yet to come.
Oh oh... I recall such kind of application from a guy who had all kinds of small jobs but no time to do them and wanted to outsource them. I believe he posted a job ad in Jack Ganssle's Embedded Muse mailing list; that's where I got his address from IIRC.
This is RS232 data logger is some kind of test, when you ask for exact specifications he suddenly has no time or something like that. Is been a while ago so can't recall the details. Anyway, it turned out to be something weird and bogus
Thanks! I'll keep this in mind if the proposal continues to move forward. |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 22, 2007 - 12:21 AM |
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Joined: Oct 30, 2002
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I suffer from bad memory  so likely I'm completely wrong
I have this stupid habit to never delete any email I receive, so I think I can look up the email conversation I had with him, when I'm at work. |
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Posted: Sep 22, 2007 - 12:30 AM |
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jayjay1974 wrote:
I suffer from bad memory so likely I'm completely wrong
I have this stupid habit to never delete any email I receive, so I think I can look up the email conversation I had with him, when I'm at work.
Sure... It would be good to know what/who I'm dealing with and, have the upper hand.
Thanks! |
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Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Sep 25, 2007 - 04:36 PM |
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Joined: Oct 30, 2002
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Location: The Netherlands
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I just looked through my emails, I'm wrong The guy I emailed with is from the USA, not the UK.
Bad memory, bad memory.
Good luck with the datalogger |
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 06:52 PM |
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Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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This past Tuesday I got up and did my usual morning routine. I usually smoke a cigarette, drink a cup of coffee and look at my e-mail for the nightly CareerBuilder.com job postings.
Well, there was a job posting that caught my eye saying "Electronics Technician needed - MUST BE ABLE TO USE AN OSCILLOSCOPE!" Yeah! Right! But that isn't what caught my eye. This job was 10 miles down the road, in Batavia, Ohio.
I loaded up a cover letter and resume and fired it off over the Internet.
I went and got my coffee and smoked a cigarette. Coming back to the computer to do my morning fix of AVRFreaks, I noticed that I had a new e-mail.
Well, it was that company, wanting me to come in for an interview. We set it up for 9:00 am on Friday. So today, I went to that interview.
I get there and a long haired hippie walks in the door with me. It turns out that he was applying for the job too but, he had no appointment for an interview. He was sent away, I when into the interview.
We talked for about an hour and then I got the tour - definitely a good sign. Upon leaving, I was told that there were three more candidates, yet to be interviewed. Okay, I see it coming... The same old story! But I said "Thank you for your time. and left, thinking that this would just be another disappointment.
Two hours later, I'm at home playing on my workbench, and the telephone rings. It's that company! They are offering me the job and I can start on Monday! This is an electronic assembly company. They have some of the most Hi-Tech assembly equipment I've seen, right next to my house! They do "Pick & Place " of the SMD components, make masking for solder paste placement, re-flow, automated testing - My God! I didn't even know this place was there!
This folks, could be the play ground of play grounds for me!
Okay, the money? You want to know about the money!
It'll pay the bills and I can survive?
But!!! Money isn't everything! This could very well be my dream job - I hope!!!
Money aside... I'm going to be "A kid in a candy factory! " |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
Last edited by microcarl on Oct 26, 2007 - 08:53 PM; edited 1 time in total
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 06:56 PM |
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Blessings in disguise sure are wonders aren't they. Just gotta keep your head level and not looking down or you'll miss them.
Good for you Carl. |
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 07:12 PM |
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Let me be one of the first people to congratulate you Carl, that's great !
When I'd had enough of my last job after 16 years my pay has gone from £45k to £20k... it's tough certainly but I'm happy as larry in my new job with no stress at all (and I get to blow things up )
Hope it all goes well.
Regards,
Robin |
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 07:21 PM |
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Location: Hilversum - the Netherlands
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Now that is good news on this friday-night: congratulations Carl.
Cheers
Nard |
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Dragon broken ? Or problems with the Parallel Port Programmer ? Scroll down on my projects-page http://www.aplomb.nl/TechStuff/TechStuff.html for tips
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 07:33 PM |
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Joined: Aug 22, 2004
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Location: Germany
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Carl, that are very good news.
I'm glad to hear that.
Hope that you'll arrive in a comfortable work enviroment
and you'll face interesting challenges.
I wish you all the best!
Regards
Sebastian |
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 08:42 PM |
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Location: Charlottesville, VA USA
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Congratulations Carl !!! What will be your job duties? The last company I worked for before NRAO was an electronics assembly house. Very small though, 13 employees.
Isn't life weird? I found this job at NRAO totally by accident. Mailed resume, interviewed and received job offer within 2 weeks. But 1 day, WOW.
Good luck !!!
edit: Does this place just do assembly or will they do engineering as well if a customer needs it?
edit2: What is the smallest quantity of boards they will assemble?
Regards,
Steve |
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 08:54 PM |
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Joined: Dec 15, 2003
Posts: 4403
Location: Slovakia, Bratislava
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| Congrats Carl! Just remember: Drooling over new electronic toys may short circuit them |
_________________
There are pointy haired bald people.
Time flies when you have a bad prescaler selected.
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 08:54 PM |
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Joined: Dec 08, 2004
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Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
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| Glad to hear of this turn of events, Carl. |
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 09:06 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
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Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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What I can tell you right now is that this is a small company that is growing. They do all aspects of SMD PCB assembly. They have about 35 employees. They have about 200 consistent, loyal customers.
They have solder mask making machines, SMD Pick & place machines, re-flow ovens and, all kinds of rework equipment. They operate the mask, paste and pick & place equipment on first and second shift. QC, secondary (thru-hole) assembly and test operates only one shift – 6:00am to 2:45pm. I’ll work the 6:00am to 2:45pm shift. I might have to work some overtime but, the company is of the mindset to hire people, rather then work the current employees to death.
My job is to schedule, setup test equipment and handle any details that may be involved with keeping the tester (mostly women) moving. When defective PCB are found, I’ll be the one determining the problem and replacing the defective component. I’ll get to learn and use some very hi-tech SMD rework stations. They require excellent soldering skills. As I already use PB free solder (have been now for about three years) learning the issues with PB won’t be that significant.
I am excited because, I’ve been really wanting to get back into hard-core electronics, but just didn’t know how to get there as, wages are usually so low. But, as my wife will tell you, electronics is my fist love, and she knows it well – first hand. With this job, not only do I get to stretch into more advanced technology in terms of ICs, I’ll get to play with Doppler radar (baseball speeds) detectors, RF, and other new technology, I’ll get to learn – first hand – the SMD techniques used out in industry and how I can incorporate them into my personal goals with PCB design and manufacturing. And, I will have access to this equipment in my personal endeavors!
As far as the smallest assembly order, I'll check into it, once I get my feet in the door and on the ground. |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 09:12 PM |
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Joined: Jul 18, 2005
Posts: 62341
Location: (using avr-gcc in) Finchingfield, Essex, England
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Carl,
That's GREAT news - by the way I need you to PM me your address at some point so I can send you that thing we discussed previously
Cliff |
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 09:39 PM |
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Joined: Nov 10, 2005
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Location: Redmond, WA
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Congratulations, Carl! It's good to hear you will be starting so soon and that you'll be learning many new skills. Best wishes to you and your family!
Tom |
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 10:38 PM |
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Location: New Mexico
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 11:19 PM |
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Joined: Sep 04, 2002
Posts: 21271
Location: Orlando Florida
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| How you gonna get time off to fly to Idaho to break in that mechanical cow? (heck... program might work 1st time... just port it over and try it) |
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Imagecraft compiler user
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 11:27 PM |
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Joined: Nov 10, 2005
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Location: Redmond, WA
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Quote:
How you gonna get time off to fly to Idaho to break in that mechanical cow? (heck... program might work 1st time... just port it over and try it)
I ride by bicycle to (northern) Idaho a couple of times a week. Let me know if you need someone to go kick the cow.
Tom |
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 11:34 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
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Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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bobgardner wrote:
How you gonna get time off to fly to Idaho to break in that mechanical cow? (heck... program might work 1st time... just port it over and try it)
First! I'm not going to Idaho!!! All I'm providing is an electrically tested & working controller and the command shell. (Not related to the ongoing discussion about pointers to arrays of functions, though, I'll be using this technique there too) along the LCD, keyboard, I/O, and EEPROM read/write routines. Once that part is complete, I'm off the hook. And, it will work correctly when it is shipped to the client - the first time!
The client will be writing the actual application to play mechanical cow...
Bob, I'm loosing confidence in your ability to being our daddy! You'd better watch it, you could be replaced!!! |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Oct 26, 2007 - 11:43 PM |
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Joined: May 26, 2004
Posts: 2538
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada
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| Excellent news, Carl. In my experience of dealing with contract manufacturers, the difference between "great job, guys" and "dumb as a bag of hammers" is whether they have an engineer on staff. Please PM me the company name. |
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Posted: Oct 27, 2007 - 02:04 AM |
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Joined: Nov 17, 2004
Posts: 13847
Location: Vancouver, BC
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Great news, Carl! Congratulations!
I am working as a programmer through a similar fluke. I was out of a job and I happened to see an add for programming that looked interesting. I didn't have any experience programming professionally, but I applied anyways. I got the job in large part because they liked the fact that I was mostly self taught. |
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Regards,
Steve A.
The Board helps those that help themselves.
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Posted: Oct 27, 2007 - 02:33 AM |
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Joined: Jul 02, 2005
Posts: 5946
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Congratulations Carl!
With work being only 10 miles away, you will be able to get out your old rattler of a bicycle and ride to work a few days a week and save on the petrol costs as well. You might even loose a few pounds, and get a new haircut and take your favourite lady out for a bang-up meal, and ....woa there Neddy....let's get this under control. One day at a time. Enjoy every one of them.
Cheers, |
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Ross McKenzie
ValuSoft
Melbourne Australia
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Posted: Oct 27, 2007 - 02:40 AM |
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Joined: Jul 10, 2006
Posts: 2655
Location: Minneapolis
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@Steve, you once said you've been programming for 30 years. Have you been working the same job for that long?
@Carl, it's nice to see the excitement in your posts. Good for you! |
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Posted: Oct 27, 2007 - 02:52 AM |
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Joined: Feb 14, 2007
Posts: 1858
Location: San Diego California
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Congratulations Carl first time back at Freaks in over a week and what great news to read!
Sounds like you got some great toys to play with too.
Way to go!!!!!!!!!
Best of luck
John |
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Resistance is futile…… You will be compiled!
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Posted: Oct 27, 2007 - 03:02 AM |
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Joined: Jul 02, 2005
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Location: Melbourne, Australia
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AllN wrote:
Congratulations Carl first time back at Freaks in over a week and what great news to read!
Sounds like you got some great toys to play with too.
Way to go!!!!!!!!!
Best of luck
John
John,
Have you been touched by the fires?
Regards, |
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Ross McKenzie
ValuSoft
Melbourne Australia
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Posted: Oct 27, 2007 - 03:22 AM |
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Joined: Feb 14, 2007
Posts: 1858
Location: San Diego California
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OT
@:-Ross
My family and I are fine! My eldest daughter’s house was threatened but spared.
I was out of town. Flew back and been helping move people and pets, (horses, goats, sheep, emus, … you name it we moved it.
I’m exhausted but grateful so much was spared. 3 close friends and a couple friends of friends of the family lost homes but everyone is safe and they all had insurance.
The first two days we had more volunteers than officials but there has no red tape very efficient sort of an organized chaos. What a contrast to New Orleans makes me wonder?
Thanks for asking,
John |
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Resistance is futile…… You will be compiled!
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Posted: Oct 27, 2007 - 03:50 AM |
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Joined: Jun 04, 2007
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Location: Cincinnati, Ohio - USA
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| Great news Carl. I wish you the best! |
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Posted: Oct 27, 2007 - 05:00 AM |
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Location: Apalachin, NY, USA
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Way to go Carl. Best of luck!
Don |
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Posted: Oct 27, 2007 - 06:13 AM |
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Joined: Oct 03, 2007
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Location: Tucson, AZ
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| Great News Carl!!!!!! I'm really happy for you! |
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Michael
Dragon Slayer... no not that one...This one!
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Posted: Oct 27, 2007 - 10:24 AM |
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Joined: Oct 17, 2003
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Location: Germany
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I´ve been here at AVRfreaks the last two days, but obviously missed this thread.
Let me join the row of felicitators:
Carl, congratulations on your new job.
I hope you´ll enjoy every minute (and the added free time thanks to the shorter
commute compared to the last job).
Cheers!
Ingo |
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Posted: Oct 27, 2007 - 01:18 PM |
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Joined: Mar 07, 2001
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Location: Stockholm, Sweden
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Congrats Carl,
Sounds like a great job. Close to home and interesting company. |
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/Jesper
http://www.yampp.com
The quick black AVR jumped over the lazy PIC.
What boots up, must come down.
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Posted: Oct 27, 2007 - 01:28 PM |
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Joined: Jun 27, 2005
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Location: St.Petersburg, Russia
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| I missed that merry posting too. Congratulations, Carl! |
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The Dark Boxes are coming.
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Posted: Oct 27, 2007 - 01:54 PM |
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Joined: Aug 19, 2004
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Location: Adelaide South Australia
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Carl.!
Just picked up the wonderful news and I'm really happy for you.
New toys, new out look, Sky is blue and the Sun is shinning! |
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73's
Roy
VK5ASY
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Posted: Oct 28, 2007 - 02:42 AM |
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Location: Vancouver, BC
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Quote:
@Steve, you once said you've been programming for 30 years. Have you been working the same job for that long?
I have been programming for 30 years, I have been paid to do it for only 10. |
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Regards,
Steve A.
The Board helps those that help themselves.
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Posted: Oct 28, 2007 - 03:06 AM |
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Quote:
I have been programming for 30 years, I have been paid to do it for only 10.
One nice thing about this profession is that you are exposed to so many interesting technologies and can dwell on the one(s) that interest you most. Paid to play; how many people can say that? |
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Posted: Oct 28, 2007 - 06:18 AM |
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Location: Tampere, Finland
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Congratulations on your new job too, Carl!
My "unemployed" news: I've been looking after my kid for a week or so now and my wife has already been in few exams so she can work on her degree too. The news about the company being closed and people being fired have been spreading and I have received several emails and even a few phone calls from friends and ex-coworkers about some companies who are hiring and to whom I should send my CV.
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Posted: Oct 28, 2007 - 01:39 PM |
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Location: Hemel Hemsptead, UK
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I sense that Carl is going to be making some *superlative* circuit boards for his projects
Congratulations, Carl! |
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Neil Barnes
www.nailed-barnacle.co.uk
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Posted: Oct 28, 2007 - 08:23 PM |
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Location: Orlando Florida
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| What would be a great 'silver bullet' advantage for Carl's PC house is offering to sanity check the schematic in addition to rules checking the layout. Who cares if the spacing is ok if the wires are going to the wrong place? I suppose most places order 2 bds initially and build those up and test them.... if someone that could read the schematic (Carl?) saw a booboo before the boards were run, that's 'bad' for the board house, but the little 5 man company that was buying the board would be so grateful for saving them $100, they'd come back again and again. This step would not be needed on the production run... beware of a run of 100+ bds that hasnt had a 2bd test run first.... unless the company is 'Innovative Beer Coasters' |
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Imagecraft compiler user
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Posted: Oct 28, 2007 - 09:05 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
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Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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bobgardner wrote:
if someone that could read the schematic (Carl?) saw a booboo before the boards were run, that's 'bad' for the board house...
That is part of it. Before the boards are assembled, I have to look at the documentation and see if we can actually test it or, if the customer needs to provide a test fixture for testing. This company does some static testing. Sometimes it on a "Bed of Nails ". Sometimes it just a visual check for proper values/numbers on components using a vision system. But the company "Spectra Tech " told me that most customers want full functionality checks made on all of their assembled PCBs being shipped out the door. |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Oct 29, 2007 - 12:46 AM |
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Joined: Sep 04, 2002
Posts: 21271
Location: Orlando Florida
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| I still dont know how a board house would gang program a couple hundred boards with tqfp avrs on them. I can see a person manually sticking the jtag into the socket and running a batch file, and I have done runs of a hundred or so, but every once in a while, the phone rings and you forget if you just did the fuses but havent done the flash yet or something.... any procedure that relies on a human to do a dozen steps in a row correctly a hundred times sure wont have a three sigma error rate. We sent a run of 500 boards somewhere, and I sent them my manual procure writeup, and I suppose some tech sat there and programmed all of them one at a time. Does a gang programmer just open loop write all the bytes in parallel, then you verify one at a time? To do this on tqfps youd need a fixture to fit over the chip... probably would cost several hundred $$... cant see getting 8 of them to work at the same time.... |
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Imagecraft compiler user
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Posted: Oct 29, 2007 - 01:07 AM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
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Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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| Bob, I haven't got a clue. I haven't started there yet! I'll let you know how they do it when I'm told that I have to get it done. Until then, it's all just speculation... |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Oct 29, 2007 - 12:58 PM |
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Joined: Apr 12, 2007
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Location: Windsor, UK
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Good luck Carl; if there was a chance you could get them to start doing small volumes/prototypes for reasonable prices, I'd certainly look into giving you my custom.
To keep it into the freak's family |
_________________
Author of simavr - Follow me on twitter : @buserror
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Posted: Oct 30, 2007 - 12:20 PM |
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Joined: Jul 02, 2005
Posts: 5946
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Hi Carl,
You should have finished your first day at the new place. How did it go?
Cheers, |
_________________
Ross McKenzie
ValuSoft
Melbourne Australia
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Posted: Oct 30, 2007 - 08:24 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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valusoft wrote:
Hi Carl,
You should have finished your first day at the new place. How did it go?
Cheers,
Actually, I just now finished my second day.
I have found myself a new home, I think!
So far, its pretty easy. I simply do what they need me to. They seem quite surprised that I can come in the door and start fixing stuff.
Yesterday I worked on Golf Club swing radar speed monitors. They've got these things too, for baseball bat swing velocity, paint ball velocity and I can't remember what else.
Today I worked on the electronics for some high speed infrared proximity sensors and some sort of thingies with a PIC on it. Oh yeah... The radar thingies also use PIC. But either they are either pre-programmed or we program the binaries into the PICs using one of those high $$$ PIC programmers.
I was told today that I will be getting some sort of soldering certification. I'm not sure by which organization, though. The company is ISO2000 certified so, what ever organization that falls within the ISO propaganda will probably be doing the soldering and training and certification.
That's about it! I'll keep you posted... |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Oct 30, 2007 - 08:56 PM |
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Joined: Aug 20, 2005
Posts: 1109
Location: Pool of Goo
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Quote:
Today I worked on the electronics for some high speed infrared proximity sensors and some sort of thingies with a PIC on it. Oh yeah... The radar thingies also use PIC. But either they are either pre-programmed or we program the binaries into the PICs using one of those high $$$ PIC programmers.
considering how much you love PICS hopefully this work will not be too stressfull! might have to remove those AVR tattoos too |
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Posted: Oct 30, 2007 - 09:06 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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bluegoo wrote:
Quote:
Today I worked on the electronics for some high speed infrared proximity sensors and some sort of thingies with a PIC on it. Oh yeah... The radar thingies also use PIC. But either they are either pre-programmed or we program the binaries into the PICs using one of those high $$$ PIC programmers.
considering how much you love PICS hopefully this work will not be too stressfull! might have to remove those AVR tattoos too
Just give me a little bit of time! I'll educate e'm. I already have a scheme to cut the testing time for the infrared proximity sensors in half - and provide parametrics testing, as well; rather then just a go-no-go test.
There are some Altera chips there. Nub I haven't gotten to really look at the PCB's yet. There in assembly right now. I'm sure they'll be coming my way in a week or so.
But I do see a lot of PICs! Thank God I don't have to write programs for them... |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Oct 30, 2007 - 09:16 PM |
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Joined: Nov 14, 2001
Posts: 3438
Location: Charlottesville, VA USA
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Quote:
Thank God I don't have to write programs for them...
Yet |
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Posted: Oct 30, 2007 - 09:24 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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SteveN wrote:
Quote:
Thank God I don't have to write programs for them...
Yet
No, not likely... If I have the opportunity to do any programming, it'll be using an AVR. I see lots of opportunities coming my way that will let me bring in the AVR for testing purposes.
Long live the AVR!!! |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Oct 30, 2007 - 09:33 PM |
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Joined: Dec 15, 2003
Posts: 4403
Location: Slovakia, Bratislava
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Spreading the good word of Atmel, are you Carl ?
On the soldering: Maybe you can teach them some nice new tricks |
_________________
There are pointy haired bald people.
Time flies when you have a bad prescaler selected.
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Posted: Oct 30, 2007 - 10:54 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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daqq wrote:
Spreading the good word of Atmel, are you Carl ?
On the soldering: Maybe you can teach them some nice new tricks
Maybe electronics tricks! But they've got it all over me with soldering...
I did my first PB-free soldering today. it isn't the soldering that is hard, it's removing the components. And, there are so many restrictions. My work bench is a PB class area. To remove a component from a PB-free PCB, I've got to go to another work bench that is PB-free.
I troubleshot about 50 PB-free boards today. That took about 3 hours. I spent the rest of the day removing defective LED and IR xmiter & xcvr LEDs. I'm about half way finished. then its back to the PB bench to run them thru testing again.
Ya got to love it!
But the soldering it quite nice. They have at least one Metcal station. I can't remember what the name of the other soldering equipment is, though. |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Oct 31, 2007 - 12:05 AM |
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Joined: Jul 02, 2005
Posts: 5946
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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microcarl wrote:
valusoft wrote:
Hi Carl,
You should have finished your first day at the new place. How did it go?
I have found myself a new home, I think!
Yesterday I worked on Golf Club swing radar speed monitors.
My first reading of that sentence gave me the impression that you were practising your golf swing....what a workplace...fun first, work last...go man go!
Don't forget to go home each day.
Cheers, |
_________________
Ross McKenzie
ValuSoft
Melbourne Australia
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Posted: Nov 01, 2007 - 02:28 AM |
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Joined: Feb 19, 2001
Posts: 25921
Location: Wisconsin USA
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Koshchi wrote:
I have been programming for 30 years, I have been paid to do it for only 10.
"I've had over a dozen years of a happy marriage."
"Oh, really? When did you get married?"
"1967." |
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Posted: Nov 01, 2007 - 03:35 AM |
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Joined: Mar 28, 2001
Posts: 20387
Location: Sydney, Australia (Gum trees, Koalas and Kangaroos, No Edelweiss)
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Quote:
there are so many restrictions.
So if you get shot can you still work in a PB free zone??  ...I guess they will need to make PB free bullets soon or the crooks will be out of business. |
_________________
John Samperi
Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.
www.ampertronics.com.au
* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly
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Posted: Nov 01, 2007 - 04:26 AM |
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Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Posts: 6702
Location: Bellingham, WA - USA
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Quote:
"I've had over a dozen years of a happy marriage."
"Oh, really? When did you get married?"
"1967."
"How long have you been married?"
"Almost long enough." |
_________________
Chuck Baird
"It's better to catch the trapeze than test the safety net" -- RPi book
http://www.cbaird.org
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Posted: Nov 01, 2007 - 07:32 PM |
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Joined: Feb 19, 2001
Posts: 25921
Location: Wisconsin USA
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Carl was quite nervous when he arrived at his important job interview.
The interviewer wanted to know something about Carl's personality, so asked him "If you could have a conversation with someone, living or dead, who would it be?"
Carl quickly replied: "The living one." |
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Posted: Nov 01, 2007 - 09:59 PM |
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Joined: Mar 28, 2001
Posts: 20387
Location: Sydney, Australia (Gum trees, Koalas and Kangaroos, No Edelweiss)
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Quote:
"The living one."
But people talk with dead people all the time, I have seen it on telly...some of the dead people are rude though, they just ignore the converstion and say nothing... |
_________________
John Samperi
Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.
www.ampertronics.com.au
* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly
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Posted: Nov 03, 2007 - 10:15 PM |
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Joined: Jul 24, 2006
Posts: 1300
Location: Missouri
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Congrats Carl and best of luck!!!
JOHN |
_________________
You may only be one person in the world but, you may be the world to one person!
"Life! Life, do you hear me? Give my creation LIFE!" Gene Wilder
SKYPE Name: JonRobrt
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Posted: Nov 27, 2007 - 11:45 PM |
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Joined: Nov 14, 2001
Posts: 3438
Location: Charlottesville, VA USA
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Carl,
How is the new job? They got you writing software for any of those PIC's yet? They must be keeping you busy, we don't see you here as much.
Regards,
Steve |
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Posted: Nov 27, 2007 - 11:48 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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SteveN wrote:
How is the new job? They got you writing software for any of those PIC's yet? They must be keeping you busy, we don't see you here as much.
The new job seems to be going great, it's just a little lite on wages. But money really isn't everything!
I've been on the forum pretty much every day! Just as Bob Gardner, I've been following him around, giving him a hard time as often as I can... |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Nov 27, 2007 - 11:53 PM |
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Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Posts: 6702
Location: Bellingham, WA - USA
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| Carl, did you notice that was post #5000? I'd say you're here, all right. Half a Cliff's worth. |
_________________
Chuck Baird
"It's better to catch the trapeze than test the safety net" -- RPi book
http://www.cbaird.org
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Posted: Nov 27, 2007 - 11:56 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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zbaird wrote:
Carl, did you notice that was post #5000? I'd say you're here, all right. Half a Cliff's worth.
And it too me twice the amount of time to get to 5,000 posts as it did for Cliff to get to 10,000 posts, too!
Cliff must type twice as fast as I do and probably has twice as much to say, that is twice as valuable as what I have to say!
Just ask all of those who I've pissed off??? |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Nov 28, 2007 - 06:55 AM |
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Joined: Aug 22, 2004
Posts: 1624
Location: Germany
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zbaird wrote:
Carl, did you notice that was post #5000? I'd say you're here, all right. Half a Cliff's worth.
Doesn't the length of Carl's antenna equal the difference?
However, congratulations Carl. Your posts do increase the worth of this forum a lot.
Regards
Sebastian |
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Posted: Nov 28, 2007 - 07:11 AM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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S-Sohn wrote:
zbaird wrote:
Carl, did you notice that was post #5000? I'd say you're here, all right. Half a Cliff's worth.
Doesn't the length of Carl's antenna equal the difference?
However, congratulations Carl. Your posts do increase the worth of this forum a lot.
Regards
Sebastian
Thanks! It's time for me to hit the sack! |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Nov 28, 2007 - 07:03 PM |
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Joined: Sep 04, 2002
Posts: 21271
Location: Orlando Florida
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| Carl and Jim... can you two ham guys talk on hf or packet radio? |
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Imagecraft compiler user
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Posted: Nov 28, 2007 - 10:31 PM |
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Joined: May 30, 2004
Posts: 8118
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
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bobgardner wrote:
Carl and Jim... can you two ham guys talk on hf or packet radio?
I can do packet on 2 meters (144MHZ to 148MHZ), if I have a mind to set it all back up.
I do need to upgrade, now that everything has gone no-code. It's really sad... I passed the written General twice. But I just didn't have the drive to learn the code well enough to take the test. I really struggled with being forced to learn something I'd never use - just to join the club. I did too much of that in school! |
_________________
Carl W. Livingston, KC5OTL
microcarl@roadrunner.com
"There are only two ways to sleep well at night... be ignorant or be prepared."
The original Dragon Slayer !
Long live the AVR!!!
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Posted: Nov 29, 2007 - 07:59 PM |
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Joined: Nov 10, 2005
Posts: 1527
Location: Redmond, WA
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I stick with CW, just for the joy of it.
KC7ZEW |
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Posted: Nov 29, 2007 - 08:15 PM |
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Joined: Sep 04, 2002
Posts: 21271
Location: Orlando Florida
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I passed the 5wpm test for the novice ticket.
KC4AVC |
_________________
Imagecraft compiler user
Last edited by bobgardner on Nov 29, 2007 - 09:52 PM; edited 1 time in total
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Posted: Nov 29, 2007 - 08:21 PM |
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Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Posts: 6702
Location: Bellingham, WA - USA
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| I got a ticket for passing a novice at 5mph over. |
_________________
Chuck Baird
"It's better to catch the trapeze than test the safety net" -- RPi book
http://www.cbaird.org
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Posted: Nov 30, 2007 - 08:23 AM |
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Joined: Jul 02, 2005
Posts: 5946
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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I had to buy my ticket....in a raffle, and still didn't win.  |
_________________
Ross McKenzie
ValuSoft
Melbourne Australia
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