XMEGA

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That was I was going to say:)

Caleb

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Whoohoo! 2 weeks away :smile:

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clawson wrote:
Not sure how you consider an overlap between AVR32 and X-AVR8 ? They are quite different devices with quite different purposes. It's like saying an ARM overlaps any form of AVR8 - it doesn't.

(BTW I think your rumour may be just slightly optimisitic - but there is an intersting thing somewhere on the atmel.com web site ;) )


Ah ha - all is revealed - so the "interesting thing somewhere on the atmel.com" site was merely:

http://www.atmel.com/corporate/c...

(my spies had told me there'd "be an annoucement in February" - of course that will always mean the last few days, not the first few days!)

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Quote:
my spies had told me there'd "be an annoucement in February"

My spies must be better than yours since they told me exactly when and where ;)

Quote:
Whoohoo! 2 weeks away

Don't get too excited. This is for the announcement. I would bet that the chip availability won't be for a few more months.

Regards,
Steve A.

The Board helps those that help themselves.

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Ah well, my spies told me that some selected people already had samples - or by "availability" did you mean with the distis?

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clawson wrote:
"be an annoucement in February" - of course that will always mean the last few days, not the first few days!)
Yep, just like "before the end of the year" almost always means between Christmas and New Year's Eve.

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My spies tell me Atmel has WMD, but I'm not buying it.

Smiley

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Quote:
My spies tell me Atmel has WMD, but I'm not buying it
HOWEVER, just to be on the safe side, send in 100k troops...you never know. :?

John Samperi

Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.

www.ampertronics.com.au

* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly

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smileymicros wrote:
My spies tell me Atmel has WMD
Wares for Mass Distribution -- they just might have them! :wink:

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Today?!?

A site search at atmel.com uncovers several hits tonight...

Lee

You can put lipstick on a pig, but it is still a pig.

I've never met a pig I didn't like, as long as you have some salt and pepper.

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It is a probability that it will be relased today, since the embedded world conference starts today, and there many companies releases their new stuff!

Hope so :)

EDIT!!

The XMEGA and STK600 specs are now available av the atmel.com website :) :) :)

So can't be long until we can order it.

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What's with STK500 Mk2? Anyone knows anything about it?....or do you want me to do a search...?

John Samperi

Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.

www.ampertronics.com.au

* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly

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STK500 Mk2 ? Hmm never heard of it..

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Some of the xml part description files have STK500_2 as well as STK500 in the module list :roll:

Quote:
[SIMULATOR:ICE50:STK500:STK500_2:AVRISPmkII:AVRDragon:STK600]

John Samperi

Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.

www.ampertronics.com.au

* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly

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hmm... did a quick search on atmel and google, but didn't get anything.

Could be an alternative to the stk600 ?

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Don't know! Anyway all of my hopes of just dropping in an A3 into one of my CONT3 modules have vanished as the pinout is different than the M64/M128 :(

John Samperi

Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.

www.ampertronics.com.au

* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly

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PLL up to 31x. Does this mean 31*32MHz?
Wow thats ultra fast PWM. :P

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Quote:
PLL up to 31x. Does this mean 31*32MHz?
Wow thats ultra fast PWM.

Oh yes :) Soooo looking forward to it can be ordered:)

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js wrote:

> Some of the xml part description files have STK500_2 as well as STK500 in the module list

That's the version 2 firmware of the STK500, which is now already
quite dated.

Jörg Wunsch

Please don't send me PMs, use email if you want to approach me personally.

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:oops: I thought it could have been a STK500 with a Dragon front end...

John Samperi

Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.

www.ampertronics.com.au

* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly

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Well, I've just been reading the datasheets, and I'm disappointed. The XMEGAs look great, but I was hoping to be able to use the DMA facility to capture a stream of parallel data at around 5MB/s, clocked by an external signal. There doesn't seem to be any such facility. Oh well... Just have to wait for the XGIGAs to be announced...

Quebracho seems to be the hardest wood.

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Quote:
Well, I've just been reading the datasheets, and I'm disappointed.

...Always someone who must complain ... :D

But I guess that is what forces the development for next generation beyond next generation..

Regards
Vidar (Z)

----------------------------------------------------------

"The fool wonders, the wise man asks"

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Oh no! More rabbits!

Quebracho seems to be the hardest wood.

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Xgiga, nice one :lol:

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John_A_Brown wrote:
Well, I've just been reading the datasheets, and I'm disappointed. The XMEGAs look great, but I was hoping to be able to use the DMA facility to capture a stream of parallel data at around 5MB/s, clocked by an external signal.

If you can work with serial data: in theory rev. H. AT32UC3 micros should clock almost 8 Mbytes/sec over SPI. Less wiring, too. My engineering sample puts out measly 3.75 Mbytes/sec.

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Where's the "Trade your soul for one of them" form? I can't find the link :-(

There are pointy haired bald people.
Time flies when you have a bad prescaler selected.

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One thing that:

http://www.atmel.com/products/AV...

doesn't give, of course, is any idea of availability. I don't know if it's common knowledge or not but I'll risk it anyway - I was told the the two initial devices would be the 64A1 and the 128A1 but I don't know when and I don't know how far behind the others will lag or whether they're actually planning to get them all available at the same time after all?

Cliff

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Quote:
doesn't give, of course, is any idea of availability.

It does say "100% predictable timing", however, if that gives you any clues...

Quebracho seems to be the hardest wood.

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I was told that they would be released soon, where soon means anything between yesterday and next century. Most probably, ready for mass production by the end of the year (which one, is unknown) the first two models (IIRC, atmel respresentative told me about the same models that Cliff mentions).

Anyway, not big difference between dec-31 and jan-01. I would be out of the office both days. ;)

Guillem.
"Common sense is the least common of the senses" Anonymous.

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Next decade is going to be very interesting !!!

Atmel is making the right moves !

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Quote:

John_A_Brown wrote:
Well, I've just been reading the datasheets, and I'm disappointed. The XMEGAs look great, but I was hoping to be able to use the DMA facility to capture a stream of parallel data at around 5MB/s, clocked by an external signal.

If you can work with serial data: in theory rev. H. AT32UC3 micros should clock almost 8 Mbytes/sec over SPI. Less wiring, too. My engineering sample puts out measly 3.75 Mbytes/sec.


I'm kind of with John on this one. I thought from reading the earlier "leaked" documents that streaming from a port was included. But maybe I was thinking of SAM7.

The most obvious application that I can think of is "logic analyzer", or a "'scope" faster than the on-board A/D.

Lee

You can put lipstick on a pig, but it is still a pig.

I've never met a pig I didn't like, as long as you have some salt and pepper.

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theusch wrote:
Quote:

John_A_Brown wrote:
Well, I've just been reading the datasheets, and I'm disappointed. The XMEGAs look great, but I was hoping to be able to use the DMA facility to capture a stream of parallel data at around 5MB/s, clocked by an external signal.

If you can work with serial data: in theory rev. H. AT32UC3 micros should clock almost 8 Mbytes/sec over SPI. Less wiring, too. My engineering sample puts out measly 3.75 Mbytes/sec.


I'm kind of with John on this one. I thought from reading the earlier "leaked" documents that streaming from a port was included. But maybe I was thinking of SAM7.

The most obvious application that I can think of is "logic analyzer", or a "'scope" faster than the on-board A/D.

Lee


FWIW, I was hoping to be able to grab a few DVB packets, and analyze them at leisure for progamme identification. However, I think the DMA in conjunction with the ADC could interest me.

Quebracho seems to be the hardest wood.

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John_A_Brown wrote:
Well, I've just been reading the datasheets, and I'm disappointed. The XMEGAs look great, but I was hoping to be able to use the DMA facility to capture a stream of parallel data at around 5MB/s, clocked by an external signal. There doesn't seem to be any such facility. Oh well... Just have to wait for the XGIGAs to be announced...

I believe this is possible by mapping "parallel data" to external memory and by using the new event system.

From the datasheet:

Quote:
"The XMEGA Direct Memory Access (DMA)Controller is a highly flexible DMA Controller capable
of transferring data between memories and peripherals with minimal CPU intervention. The DMA controller has flexible channel priority selection, several addressing modes, double buffering capabilities and large block sizes.

The DMA Controller can move data between memories and peripherals, between memories and between peripherals.

There are four DMA channels that have individual source, destination, triggers and block sizes. The different channels also have individual control settings and individual interrupt settings and interrupt vectors. Interrupt requests may be generated both when a transaction is complete or if the DMA Controller detects an error on a DMA channel. When a DMA channel requests a data transfer, the bus arbiter will wait until the AVR core is not using the data bus and permit the DMA Controller to transfer data. Transfers are done in bursts of 1, 2, 4 or 8 bytes. Addressing can be static, incremental or decremental. Automatic reload of source and/or destination address can be done after each burst transfer, block transfer, when transmission is complete, or disabled.

Both application software, peripherals and Events can trigger DMA transfers."

Last Edited: Tue. Feb 26, 2008 - 05:15 PM
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I saw that, but, looking at the DMA trigger information, I was unable to see how a strobe from an external device could be used in the DMA system. I'll look into it further.

Quebracho seems to be the hardest wood.

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John_A_Brown wrote:
I was hoping to be able to grab a few DVB packets, and analyze them at leisure for progamme identification.

Just being nosey - DVB-T, DVB-S or something else?

(it's just that in the main DVB-S source in the UK 184 of every 188 byte TS packet is scrambled anyway - so all you can identify are the PIDs)

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Regarding availability for samples, let's just say REAL SOON, and no, we're not talking end of the year. Very probably single digit weeks. ;) But that's not official.

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Thanks for the update, Erik. I expect STK600's will be available by then to assist in development as well.

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Well...I am pleased with the XMega. I was sort of hoping for a drop in replacement for the ATmega128...but I will be purchasing an Eval board as soon as they come out. It looks like it will be a lot of fun to write code for these.

-Jim

-Jim
http://www.noniandjim.com
Analog and Digital Electronics
Music Synthesizers

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patchell wrote:
Well...I am pleased with the XMega. I was sort of hoping for a drop in replacement for the ATmega128.

No, they're definitely not a drop-in replacement for the ATmega128.

However, you may be interested in the upcoming ATmega1284P. I don't know the pin-out for this chip, but think mega128, with 128K Flash, 16K RAM, 4K EEPROM and PicoPower.

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EW wrote:
Regarding availability for samples, let's just say REAL SOON, and no, we're not talking end of the year. Very probably single digit weeks. ;) But that's not official.

What base are we talking about here? Base 10 or mayber base 32?

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Quote:
Well, I've just been reading the datasheets, and I'm disappointed. The XMEGAs look great, but I was hoping to be able to use the DMA facility to capture a stream of parallel data at around 5MB/s, clocked by an external signal. There doesn't seem to be any such facility.

Well, I've been giving the xxA3 data sheet a quick read. There may be hope.

See page 11: Since the DMA can access all the peripherals through the I/O memory...

See page 12: Events can be generated by.... ports.... Events can be used by .... DMA controller

So, I'm obviously reading between the lines here, but I think with further digging we may find a way to set up the port to generate, say, a pin change event, route that event to the DMA controller as an event trigger, and have the DMA controller take input data from the I/O port.

Anyway, that's my quota of "engineering by wishful thinking" for this morning, so I had better stop now.

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EW wrote:
Regarding availability for samples, let's just say REAL SOON, and no, we're not talking end of the year. Very probably single digit weeks. ;) But that's not official.

Sorry, EW, here we go again... [and I'm tweaking you, not criticizing.]

Quote:
Availability and Pricing.
The first devices, ATxmega128A1 and ATxmega64A1 are both offered in 100-pin TQFP and BGA packages and are available now.

What part of "available now" am I having trouble understanding? I seem to repeatedly have problems with that term, especially when related to Atmel product announcements. Does that mean "Several of our 1M unit customers plus tool developers got a few of the first small engineering batch of working chips. Thus, for them, it is indeed 'available now'."

To me, "available now" means that ordinary people like myself can place an order at the disti and/or the rep, and at least get in line with my order of specific part numbers even if delivery is a ways off.

Sigh.

Still slathering to see the instruction set and a few other holes in the datasheet. Price looks OK though if those 10k prices hold: in the past, quotes for 10k of AVRs was about 50% to 60% of qty. 100 prices. Perhaps some of you volume customers can extrapolate the percentages for us.

Lee

You can put lipstick on a pig, but it is still a pig.

I've never met a pig I didn't like, as long as you have some salt and pepper.

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Wow, many wishes came true since Troubling started the thread The dream microcontroller!. Unfortunately the XMEGA still can't make coffee and wash the dishes. However, I think I can live with these restrictions.

Regards
Sebastian

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Actually I'd have thought things like coffee machines and dishwashers were perfect applications for them. :lol:

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Quote:
Where's the "Trade your soul for one of them" form?
Well, if you trade in your soul then you'll be DEAD. So the XMEGA will not be much use to you in the coffin...unless you can bring your laptop and STK600 along... :lol:

But what will you do for power once the batteries go? I guess some methane to electricity converter could do the job for a while....

Quote:
But maybe I was thinking of SAM7.
Weren't you looking at "Son of SAM7"? :?

John Samperi

Ampertronics Pty. Ltd.

www.ampertronics.com.au

* Electronic Design * Custom Products * Contract Assembly

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So - what about the XMEGA is 16b? To me, looking through the documentation, it seems to be very much an 8b family.

It is a pity that there are no CAN XMEGAs, or any smaller than 44 pins. I would really love to see a "ATXMEGACAN168". That would solve a lot of problems for me.

Lastly, is there GCC support for the XMEGAs? I couldn't find anything on the WinAVR sourceforge page about a new release... And the Atmel XMEGA site seems to only talk about IAR.

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Looks like the Xmega is going to be nice. However it seems there are still those that need a few more ob board features. I see up to 8 USART's but no USB. To compare the Xmega with the AVR32's, I wish that the AVR32 had the A/D's of the xmega but 14bit A/D:) That would be my chip of choice!

It will be fun to do a project sometime with the new Xmega!

Also what compiler support will there be. It seems GCC would not be hard to update to suport the Xmega's. Also I am wondering if Imagecraft and Codevision will be supporting the Xmega's soon.

Cheers,
Caleb

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Quote:

So - what about the XMEGA is 16b? To me, looking through the documentation, it seems to be very much an 8b family.

LOL I just came here to post this from the product announcement
Quote:
Modern CPU Built for Scalability – The 8/16-bit AVR CPU is designed for high-level languages like C. It has 16- and 32-bit arithmetic support and 16- and 24-bit memory pointers.

I was really expecting (when looking at the leaked documents a while back) to find a few enhanced instructions like MAC and/or MULW. I also noted with interest the "8/16" in the announcement and poked at the documents. I can't find anything, besides the expansion to handle the bigger memory spaces. Not really an "enhancement" to me; more like the necessary infrastructure so the extra memory space isn't wasted.

Quote:

It is a pity that there are no CAN XMEGAs, or any smaller than 44 pins. I would really love to see a "ATXMEGACAN168". That would solve a lot of problems for me.

Not having small CAN (on classic and X) seems to be a drawback for me as well, for CAN "sensors" that only need limited pins. And it sure would be nice to have the X features in a Mega48-class. But if they really do come through on the pricing the 44-pin A3/A4 wouldn't be too bad.

Quote:

Lastly, is there GCC support for the XMEGAs? I couldn't find anything on the WinAVR sourceforge page about a new release... And the Atmel XMEGA site seems to only talk about IAR.

I ASS-U-ME that now that the official product announcement is made, we'll be hearing from our compiler vendors that have been under a shroud of secrecy. Betcha a cold one that Pavel & Richard have been poking at them for quite a while, and that "support" will be there when we can get one into our sweaty palms.

But consider: What do they need to change to get going? The Instruction Set info is quite scarce, but considering that the 64k instruction space is nearly full already, there won't be many--any?--changes of substance. That's what a compiler mostly does, anyway: produces the "best" stream of machine instructions to carry out a task. All the rest of the stuff is in the I/O space and how to configure and use the peripherals. But that is just more INs and OUTs and LDS & STS which they already do.

I came across an interesting bit that I've got to dig into further--"locked" I/O configuration, unchangeable by code. Then do we get a way to >>ISP<< the I/O registers, kind of like fuses? Gotta dig further.

But I think you can agree that a compiler should be able to generate code--it is just an AVR [instruction set] in different clothing.

Can't wait. Slathering. Ordered samples from the Atmel Web site today. After all, the announcement said "available now", so I'm getting into line. Lessee--function generator. Add graphic LCD, and logic analyzer up to classic AVR speeds depending on DMA speed. Digital 'scope up to a Msps or maybe a bit more. Streaming audio, but I didn't see any mention of I2S as is in SAM7S. One of my industrial apps that is tapped out at 20MHz. Add FFT to that digital 'scope? ... [add your favourite dream here]

Power consumption: the new V & P chips can get plenty low, so not a biggie for me.

Drawback: No 5V operation, but kinda passe nowadays anyway.

Lee

You can put lipstick on a pig, but it is still a pig.

I've never met a pig I didn't like, as long as you have some salt and pepper.

Last Edited: Wed. Feb 27, 2008 - 03:24 AM
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nleahcim wrote:
So - what about the XMEGA is 16b? To me, looking through the documentation, it seems to be very much an 8b family.

I was just wondering the exact same thing. The data sheet says:
Quote:
XMEGA uses the 8/16-bit AVR RISC core
But I haven't found anything 16 bit yet beyond what the older AVRs have.

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austca wrote:
Looks like the Xmega is going to be nice. However it seems there are still those that need a few more ob board features. I see up to 8 USART's but no USB. To compare the Xmega with the AVR32's, I wish that the AVR32 had the A/D's of the xmega but 14bit A/D:) That would be my chip of choice!

It will be fun to do a project sometime with the new Xmega!

Also what compiler support will there be. It seems GCC would not be hard to update to suport the Xmega's. Also I am wondering if Imagecraft and Codevision will be supporting the Xmega's soon.

Cheers,
Caleb

IAR is traditionally the first compiler with support, but the other compilers are sure to follow in short order.

As for other features, I think you can be fairly confidant that on-board features like CAN and USB will be in the future. The "basic" general purpose models are always the first out the door, the more specialized versions come later.

Writing code is like having sex.... make one little mistake, and you're supporting it for life.

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