Getting started with Atmel Studio

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Hi all -

 

I've just begun working with all things Atmel, so hopefully I don't screw up the terminology.

 

My new job entails using the ATMega 1284P. The previous developer was running Atmel Studio 4 on Windows 7. I've been given a Windows 10 box, and would like to use Atmel Studio 7, as I'm generally a fan of keeping up to date on development tools. I found the Atmel page on converting from earlier versions (http://www.atmel.com/webdoc/atmelstudio/ch12s02s02.html) but I get an error when I try to convert:

 

Conversion Failed:Project Import Failed : The specified object file is not found in the specified location of the source project C:\CyberData\APG1284PDupontBase\APGDupont\Debug\Exe\APGDupont.dbg [Activity : Saving Atmel Studio 7.0 Solution]  

 

Can someone please tell me what I'm doing wrong?

 

As a sidebar, I read the thread about version 7 that began in March. Of particular interest was the discussion on the drivers. Do I correctly understand that I should no longer expect to see the drivers listed under "Jungo?"

 

Thanks for any help.

This topic has a solution.

M. Zimmers
Cyberdata

Last Edited: Tue. Sep 12, 2017 - 07:08 PM
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Might just be simplest to recreate from scratch and you probably learn more doing it that way anyway.

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mzimmers wrote:
I'm generally a fan of keeping up to date on development tools

But you say you've just started a new job.

 

Therefore you should discuss with your manager what the policy/plan is on this.

 

Changing tools mid-project is not something to be undertaken lightly - especially when going from such an old version!

But, then again, it sounds like they've replaced the developer (was he the only developer?), and replaced the development machine - so they must have budgeted something for you to get it all set up and up to speed.

 

Or perhaps they weren't even aware that they old guy was so far behind - in which case it would be even more important to discuss the way forward!

 

Do you have access to the previous developer's machine - for reference?

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Hi awneil -

 

I'm taking over for someone who is still here, so I can still learn from him.

 

The current challenge is that Windows 10 system doesn't seem to have the drivers set up properly for AVR Studio 4. If I understand it correctly, version 4 expects to see the drivers under "Jungo" and I now have them under "Atmel" (in the Device Manager).

 

Maybe what I should have asked is, are there major implications with upgrading from 4 to 7? If so, I can look into getting a Windows 7 system to run Studio 4. I was just hoping that I'd be able to move to the newer tools.

 

And all this is predicated on the assumption that there's some benefit to moving from 4 to 7 - if you feel this is false, please feel free to say so.

 

Thanks...

M. Zimmers
Cyberdata

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4 to 7 is a bit like switching from a manual to an electric screw driver. Some folks still think the manual does at least as good a job and there's less to go wrong ;-)
.
EDIT I love predictive text!

Last Edited: Mon. Sep 11, 2017 - 05:46 PM
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mzimmers wrote:
are there major implications with upgrading from 4 to 7?

Any update to tools mid-project requires some re-validation that the new tools don't "break" anything.

 

Have you asked why they haven't updated already?

 

The trouble with sticking with obsolete tools, as you're finding, is getting the obsolete systems to run them on!

 

Because 4 is so far behind 7, it rather unlikely that any "automated update" is going to work - which probably explains the error you're getting.

 

So I'd probably go with clawson's suggestion and re-create the project form scratch.

 

 

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Well, as they say in the South, "I got no dog in this hunt."

 

Over the years, I've found it to be a good idea to try to keep current with OSs, applications and toolsets, but I'm not wedded to the concept. I'm more than open to what people here think I should do. The goal is to get something on my system that I can use to maintain these applications.

 

We also use IAR here, so the Atmel version I use must be able to accept something called a "UBROF 8" file and a "HEX" file. (Version 4 did this.)

M. Zimmers
Cyberdata

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mzimmers wrote:
Over the years, I've found it to be a good idea to try to keep current with OSs

I would certainly agree.

 

But you say you've just started a new job - so your new employer may have a different view/policy; and, as already noted, changing tools is a non-trivial exercise - and can have impacts beyond the SW development itself.

 

A tool change like this could be a mini-project in itself - hence the importance to discuss with "management"...

 

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UBROF is a file unique to IAR.

 

HEX is the end file generated by the compiler. It is used by the programming tool to load the firmware into the target. IAR generally (always?) uses a different hardware tool to do that programming than Atmel Studio. Any programmer should be able to take a hex file and stuff it into the target, no matter whether that HEX file was created by IAR or gcc (Atmel Studio).

 

There is varying support for bootloaders and programmers between the two development environments. 

 

My personal opinion (having worked with both) is to stick with one environment or the other for a given project. Don't try to mix them - its a recipe for disaster. Its hard enough to work with different IDEs for different projects.

 

Jim

Jim Wagner Oregon Research Electronics, Consulting Div. Tangent, OR, USA http://www.orelectronics.net

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ka7ehk wrote:
HEX is the end file generated by the compiler. 

Not exactly:

 

It is extracted/converted from the output of the Linker.

 

 

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Should have written "tool chain" instead of "compiler". Close but no roses.

 

Jim

Jim Wagner Oregon Research Electronics, Consulting Div. Tangent, OR, USA http://www.orelectronics.net

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Generally it's a good principal to update to the latest version of software, but there are exceptions.  Atmel Studio is one of them.  With microprocessor development software, it's best to use [[1] the version that everyone else on your development team is using, [2] what your customers are using if they have open-source access to the source code and contribute to its improvement, [3]  what runs and loads the fastest, and [4] last but not least, what works.   If you are the only developer for this application, then 1 and 2 don't apply, so 3 and 4 would suggest sticking with Studio 4. 

 

  On my recent laptop,  Studio 7 takes about 100 seconds to simply load from clicking on the icon to being able to type chars on the edit screen.   That's about 80 seconds too long for any program.  Bloated code is an indicator that the team that wrote it doesn't quite know what they're doing.  I'm not saying that the Atmel team is incompetent: I'm only saying that my gut instinct tells me that any program that takes more than a minute to load is not to be trusted because the developers pasted together miles and miles and miles of source code together into a big fudge mix.   Which means that there are many opportunities for unnoticed "got'ya!" side effects just waiting to be discovered by the beta testing squad i.e. the users.   Just how different can the fundamentals for AVR development be when you are turning C source code into .hex files?   And since they both do fundamentally the same thing, then why does Studio 7 take 100 seconds to load and Studio 4 take about 15 seconds to load?  Over-engineering a product is not the same as improving a product.   If you can get Studio 4 to work with a Mega1284P, then I suggest sticking with Studio 4 until you absolutely have to "upgrade".

Last Edited: Mon. Sep 11, 2017 - 07:02 PM
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Does sound like the Studio 4 project is referencing C:\CyberData\APG1284PDupontBase\APGDupont\Debug\Exe\APGDupont.dbg which does not exists on disk?

:: Morten

 

(yes, I work for Atmel, yes, I do this in my spare time, now stop sending PMs)

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Hey everyone -

 

Thanks so much for all the input -- lots to think about. As I said, if I can get Studio 4 working on my system (Windows 10) I'm willing to stay with it. Originally I thought it would be easier to change IDEs, but now I'm thinking I may need to find a Windows 7 box (or run a VM) for this.

 

EDIT: Simonetta: the question isn't whether Studio 4 will work with the 1284P (it does); it's whether Studio 4 can be made to work on Windows 10. Currently it's not looking good, which is why I'm probably going to have to use a VM. I know it seems like the tail wagging the dog, but I don't know what else to do.

M. Zimmers
Cyberdata

Last Edited: Mon. Sep 11, 2017 - 11:48 PM
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mzimmers wrote:
Currently it's not looking good, ...
Others are either successful or have attempted AVR Studio 4 on Windows 10 :

http://www.avrfreaks.net/forum/studio-419-build-730-windows-10

http://www.avrfreaks.net/forum/atmel-studio-419-windows-10

http://www.avrfreaks.net/forum/avr-studio-4-doesnt-see-anymore-my-jtagice-mkii-windows-10

http://www.avrfreaks.net/forum/studio-7-and-at90s4433

Windows 10 is a work-in-progress.

When you have a functional IDE lock it and Windows 10 down (restore points, backup each Windows 10 build, consider moving to Semi-Annual Channel)

Windows 8.1 :

http://www.avrfreaks.net/forum/tutsoftavrdragon-avrstudio418sp3-win81

Windows 7 :

http://www.avrfreaks.net/forum/installing-avr-studio-419-windows-7-fixed

mzimmers wrote:
... which is why I'm probably going to have to use a VM.
For trialing without installing Windows, some Vagrant boxes have Windows 7 :

https://app.vagrantup.com/boxes/search?order=desc&page=1&provider=&q=Windows+7&sort=updated&utf8=%E2%9C%93

via https://www.vagrantup.com/

 


Microsoft

Microsoft

Windows 10 release information

https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/release-info

 

Edit : URL

 

"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller

Last Edited: Tue. Sep 12, 2017 - 02:06 AM
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Hi GChapman -

 

Thanks for those links. I followed the instructions on installing Studio 4 offline. I think I have two remaining issues:

 

My USB drivers show up under Jungo. I get the impression this is insufficient/incorrect. It seems I have two choices:

Do you have a recommendation on which to use?

 

Also, I seem to be missing a toolchain - on startup:

 

gcc plug-in: No AVR Toolchain installation found. The AVR GCC plug-in can still be used if you set up your own build tools.

I saw a reference to a gcc toolchain in one of the links you provided, in which it was posited that the gcc toolchain may be preferable to AVR's. Can you tell me where to get a version of this gcc toolchain that will work with Studio 4?

 

Thanks for all the help...I feel encouraged about getting this working.

 

M. Zimmers
Cyberdata

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Just google "atmel toolchain for Windows" and get that - AS4 4.19 should "see" it once installed. That will give you a 5.3 version of avr-gcc

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I had found this:

 

Atmel AVR 8-bit Toolchain 3.5.4 - Windows

 

It doesn't mention gcc or any GNU stuff...is it the right toolchain?

EDIT: I stand corrected. Once you begin downloading, it has "gnu-toolchain" in the filename. I'll begin installing and report back.

 

And...any opinion on the USB drivers?

 

Thanks...

M. Zimmers
Cyberdata

Last Edited: Tue. Sep 12, 2017 - 05:47 PM
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mzimmers wrote:
use those found in this installer: driver-atmel-bundle-7.0.888.exe
anyone's fyi :

Atmel Corporation

Atmel Gallery

Products

Atmel USB Installer

https://gallery.atmel.com/Products/Details/6272a8fd-68fe-43d8-a990-741878cfe7b6

Version 7.0.888

...

via browse, categories, all, utilities, USB Driver :

https://gallery.atmel.com/Products/List?q=&orderBy=&SelectedCategoryId=6767359f-d509-42ff-82b0-680ece9bd39d

mzimmers wrote:
Do you have a recommendation on which to use?
No as I'm not an AVR Studio operator though Jungo is the long-time USB layer between the Atmel Studios and Windows; it's now WinUSB instead of Jungo in Atmel Studio 7.0.1416 and subsequent.

The miklor UV_Drivers is per scottm who is an STK500 operator; the STK500's primary RS232 serial port is used to communicate with the STK500's mega8535.

For an STK500 via a bog standard USB CDC ACM dongle, Windows 10's USB driver should work (i.o.w. no need for another driver)

STK600 goes via USB.

What's the debugger and/or programmer for the mega1284P?

mzimmers wrote:
I saw a reference to a gcc toolchain in one of the links you provided, in which it was posited that the gcc toolchain may be preferable to AVR's. Can you tell me where to get a version of this gcc toolchain that will work with Studio 4?
To expand on Cliff's answer :

Microchip AVR GCC : http://www.microchip.com/development-tools/atmel-studio-7/avr-and-arm-toolchains-(c-compilers) (Note : 3.6.0 is elsewhere)

FSF AVR GCC : http://gnutoolchains.com/avr/

 


http://www.atmel.com/Images/releasenotes_avrstudio418.txt

...

Bug Fixes

*Minor fix for un-installing USB driver. Will not completely un-install so that other programs using the Jungo driver will still work.

...

via http://www.atmel.com/tools/STUDIOARCHIVE.aspx

Microsoft logo

Microsoft Windows USB Core Team Blog

What is new with Serial in Windows 10

by George Roussos [Microsoft]

https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/usbcoreblog/2015/07/29/what-is-new-with-serial-in-windows-10/

...

 

1.   Improved Serial over USB driver support in Windows 10

...

In Windows 10, we added inbox support for USB CDC Abstract Control Model (ACM) compliant hardware. Usbser.sys is now installed as a compatible ID match for USB CDC compliant hardware, without requiring a 3rd party driver or inclusion via modem INFs.

...

one of the 'elsewhere' :

Atmel

Tools Distribution

http://distribute.atmel.no/tools/opensource/Atmel-AVR-GNU-Toolchain/3.6.0/

 

"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller

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mzimmers wrote:
any opinion on the USB drivers?
My WAG is Jungo.

 

"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller

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Well, I notice now that the entries under "Jungo" in the device manager no longer have the alert icon overlaid on them, so I guess that's progress. I guess I can focus on the toolchain now. I was reading the README, and the installation instructions are rather sparse:

 

If you want to try the Atmel AVR8 GNU toolchain alone, you can download it from here1
● If you want to try the Atmel AVR8 GNU Toolchain along with Atmel Studio, you can download and install
Atmel Studio 7 or (newer) which will also install the Atmel AVR8 GNU toolchain. See Atmel Studio release
notes for more details.

So, I guess the two questions are: where should I put the directory tree, and how do I make Studio 4 aware of it? I've poked through the command settings and haven't found anything that looks right.

 

Thanks...

 

M. Zimmers
Cyberdata

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mzimmers wrote:
where should I put the directory tree, and how do I make Studio 4 aware of it?
No answer though, IIRC, there's been a few threads here about that.

 

"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller

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OK, no problem. Maybe I won't need it, since it appears that a debugger is already installed with 4, and that's all I need.

 

To summarize: I decided to forego Studio 7 and am successfully running 4 on Windows 10 thanks to this link:

 

http://www.avrfreaks.net/forum/studio-419-build-730-windows-10

 

It may be noteworthy that I didn't need to install any other drivers, though. Once I performed the installation, device manager showed the correct devices (the ISP and the JTAG) as loaded (no yellow warning sign), and it seems to run OK. I'm still not sure about my toolchain, but for my purposes what I have is sufficient.

 

Thanks again to EVERYONE who participated...this is a great forum.

M. Zimmers
Cyberdata

Last Edited: Tue. Sep 12, 2017 - 07:12 PM
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Simonetta wrote:
On my recent laptop,  Studio 7 takes about 100 seconds to simply load from clicking on the icon to being able to type chars on the edit screen.   That's about 80 seconds too long for any program.  Bloated code is an indicator that the team that wrote it doesn't quite know what they're doing.  I'm not saying that the Atmel team is incompetent: I'm only saying that my gut instinct tells me that any program that takes more than a minute to load is not to be trusted because the developers pasted together miles and miles and miles of source code together into a big fudge mix. 

 

Well there's also another side, since for me its 7.5 seconds average on 10 attemps when launching (small)project from the directory.(about 5s to load AS7 and then half of that to actually load the source files in editor and show it).

And i allready consider my PC stoneage since it's 5 years old, expect the SSD drive's.

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mzimmers wrote:
... and am successfully running 4 on Windows 10 thanks to this link:
Well done!

mzimmers wrote:
... since it appears that a debugger is already installed with 4, and that's all I need.

...

... (the ISP and the JTAG) ...

What's the make and model of the AVRISP and AVR JTAG debugger?

AVR Studio 4.19?  Yes blush

What's the Windows 10 version (via winver, ideally a build number)?

Reason : identification of a successful configuration

mzimmers wrote:
I'm still not sure about my toolchain, but for my purposes what I have is sufficient.
... because y'all have a copy of IAR EWAVR.

 


https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/release-info.aspx

https://www.iar.com/iar-embedded-workbench/?focus=wbselector#!?architecture=AVR

 

Edit : Yes

 

"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller

Last Edited: Tue. Sep 12, 2017 - 10:49 PM
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Windows Version 1703 (OS Build 15063.540).

 

Both devices are Atmel: AVRISP mkII and JTAGICE mkII. There's lots of tiny numbers on the back, but I don't know if that's information you want. According to Device Manager -> Properties, the Driver version of both is 11.1.0.0.

 

I'd love to get the toolchain integrated, but there doesn't seem to be much Atmel instruction on it, so I'll live with what I have.

M. Zimmers
Cyberdata

Last Edited: Tue. Sep 12, 2017 - 08:04 PM
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Thanks!

mzimmers wrote:
There's lots of tiny numbers on the back, but I don't know if that's information you want.
I don't but an AVRJTAGICE mkII fyi is a serial number that starts with B is XMEGA capable.

mzimmers wrote:
I'd love to get the toolchain integrated, but there doesn't seem to be much Atmel instruction on it, so I'll live with what I have.
Should be no loss as IAR EWAVR is a "better" IDE than Atmel AVR Studio 4.

If it's EWAVR-LE then it doesn't have a debugger (i.e. operate AVR Studio); otherwise, EWAVR and EWAVR-BL have the IAR C-SPY debugger.

https://www.iar.com/iar-embedded-workbench/?focus=wbselector#!?architecture=AVR&currentTab=editions-and-licensing&readMoreBlock=Product%2520editions

 

Edit : strikethru

 

"Dare to be naïve." - Buckminster Fuller

Last Edited: Tue. Sep 12, 2017 - 08:23 PM